Mothering a second batch of calves onto a cow

[FollowingHim]

Farming question for those of you who might have tried or heard of others doing odd things in the past (@Joleneakamama, @NickF...):

Is it possible to mother a second calf, or pair of calves, onto a cow, after weaning the first?

At present I have five cows that calved in late summer (February), and as that's a bad time to calve here (we aim to calve in spring, August - September) I would like them to miss a year and get back to calving in spring. Right now it's mid-winter and they still have their calves on them, but once weaned the cows would be doing nothing useful for another year, and I need them to be earning me money.

Ideally I'd like to wean them in early August, give them a day to become thoroughly engorged, then mother a couple of newborn dairy calves onto each of them. The remainder of the herd will be starting to calve in August, so that would immediately get them back in sync with everything else, they'd have new calves at the same time. Lactation should pick up to align with the demand of the young calves and increased feed quality in spring, so physiologically it should work fine. To prove that point, my great-grandmother once milked a house cow continuously for either 2 1/2 or 3 1/2 years without calving (can't recall the story clearly!), production just dropped over winter and picked up again in spring each year. They're dairy cross cows and will certainly have enough milk.

The only question is whether I can actually persuade them to accept two new calves when they haven't just given birth. Have you ever heard of anyone even trying this? Everyone has tricks for how to mother on calves, but they're all aimed at cows who have recently given birth.

 

[NickF]

Moving propagation beds at the moment. Answer is more involved than phone response. Will get back on later.

 

[NickF]

Is it possible to mother a second calf, or pair of calves, onto a cow, after weaning the first?

Yes

The only question is whether I can actually persuade them to accept two new calves when they haven't just given birth. Have you ever heard of anyone even trying this? Everyone has tricks for how to mother on calves, but they're all aimed at cows who have recently given birth.

Depends on the cow. I've heard of people washing the calves really well, rinsing and drying them. Then using a towel rubbed all over the cow and her calf, then using that towel to rub all over the new calf. Even going so far as to tie the towel onto the calf. Lock her in a stanchion or however you milk her, let the new calf suckle and see if she will accept it.

If she doesn't take to it right away and allow it to nurse again, get someone to block her view with some cardboard or something lightweight so she can't see the "stranger". And try doing that several times a day until the calf has her milk for a while. I've heard of that working. Don't know if scent is conveyed to the orphan calf, or if it's just the repeated exposure that she gives up and accepts her fate as a new/again mom.

 

[FollowingHim]

That's really encouraging @NickF, thankyou. I had no idea if anyone had done this before, but it seemed like something so obvious that someone would have tried it. Glad to know it has worked before, means it's not a stupid idea and it's worth attempting.

The washing + towel trick sounds a really good idea, it's new to me.

I've got cattleyards with a narrow race and a headbale. Last spring I mothered two calves onto a cow that had had a dead calf by putting the cow in the race and having the calves come up and drink from behind. Put some molasses on their backs to get her licking them. Took a week but it worked eventually.

I'll see if it works in a month, once calves are available, and report how it goes. If anyone has any further tips before then let me know.

 

[NickF]

Put some molasses on their backs to get her licking them. Took a week but it worked eventually.

Brilliant! Adding that to my toolbox of solutions for clients!

 

[steve]

In the case of a dead calf, I have heard of partially skinning it and putting the skin over the back of the orphan.
Yes, it will start to stink within a short time, but the calf will have that smell on it with the hide removed and the transition then goes to the calves own smell.
Just a side note for future reference, it isn’t the case for this situation.

Sorry if this grosses anyone out.

 

[NickF]

Just make sure you put lotion on the calf first... Just sayin..

 

[Asforme&myhouse]

A friend of mine who used to be a ranch hand and now has his own small herd of cattle told me the way they would do it is take a hand full of this special powder and slap it onto/into the cow’s nose and sprinkle some on the calf. Apparently it worked great. I think this is the stuff he was talking about.

Orphan-No-More Calf Claimer Powder | PBS Animal Health

Orphan-No-More Calf Claimer Powder

www.pbsanimalhealth.com

 

[FollowingHim]

A friend of mine who used to be a ranch hand and now has his own small herd of cattle told me the way they would do it is take a hand full of this special powder and slap it onto/into the cow’s nose and sprinkle some on the calf. Apparently it worked great. I think this is the stuff he was talking about.

Orphan-No-More Calf Claimer Powder | PBS Animal Health

Orphan-No-More Calf Claimer Powder

www.pbsanimalhealth.com

Interesting. We use vanilla essence with lambs in the same way - pour some up the ewe's nostrils and more down the back of the lamb. Honestly, I don't know if it works, it's just something we do, I haven't tested whether it's better with or without it! I could try that with a cow also, I'd just need a spray bottle to get it up her nose...

 

[Joleneakamama]

Interesting. We use vanilla essence with lambs in the same way - pour some up the ewe's nostrils and more down the back of the lamb. Honestly, I don't know if it works, it's just something we do, I haven't tested whether it's better with or without it! I could try that with a cow also, I'd just need a spray bottle to get it up her nose...

I have only been around cows 4 years. I still don't enderstand them like I do horses or sheep.

With the ewe I had that took the twins we rubbed them with the afterbirth from their own mother/birth so they smelled like newborns. That covered up the dog smell the one picked up rubbing on the guardian dog.
It had less to do with them smelling like "her lambs" and more to them just smelling like new "babies" as opposed to a lamb that was days to weeks old.
We have also just fed a baby on the ewe until the lamb acted like it belonged and would go for the udder. A separate small isolation pen was helpful, but could/would be bad when a ewe starts beating a baby lamb into the fence.

You might succeed with a single calf, but two would be trickier. This year I had a 6 year old seasoned ewe reject one of her twins. The small one was hypothermic and even though we fed her on her dam exclusively the vocal bonding (baby responding to the dam's voice) wasn't as string, nor the "follow mom" imprinting that happens with newborns. She ended up loving one and kicking the other in the head. I needed another job like a hole in the head and if I stupidly let it get personal with the dumb beast I'd have felt like raising BOTH her lambs and putting a bullet in her stubborn skull. She is a quality ewe....but old and set in her ways/opinions with short teats. HATEFUL to milk by hand. We used to milk her by machine, but are not set up for that right now. She is just going to raise one BEAST of a ewe that gets the milk for both, and I'm now raising the runt on the bottle.

 

[The Revolting Man]

Farming question for those of you who might have tried or heard of others doing odd things in the past (@Joleneakamama, @NickF...):

Is it possible to mother a second calf, or pair of calves, onto a cow, after weaning the first?

At present I have five cows that calved in late summer (February), and as that's a bad time to calve here (we aim to calve in spring, August - September) I would like them to miss a year and get back to calving in spring. Right now it's mid-winter and they still have their calves on them, but once weaned the cows would be doing nothing useful for another year, and I need them to be earning me money.

Ideally I'd like to wean them in early August, give them a day to become thoroughly engorged, then mother a couple of newborn dairy calves onto each of them. The remainder of the herd will be starting to calve in August, so that would immediately get them back in sync with everything else, they'd have new calves at the same time. Lactation should pick up to align with the demand of the young calves and increased feed quality in spring, so physiologically it should work fine. To prove that point, my great-grandmother once milked a house cow continuously for either 2 1/2 or 3 1/2 years without calving (can't recall the story clearly!), production just dropped over winter and picked up again in spring each year. They're dairy cross cows and will certainly have enough milk.

The only question is whether I can actually persuade them to accept two new calves when they haven't just given birth. Have you ever heard of anyone even trying this? Everyone has tricks for how to mother on calves, but they're all aimed at cows who have recently given birth.

I interviewed a guy for a newspaper article once who had won an international award for developing a way to get goats to adopt kids.

I don’t remember much about it but it seems like he separated the kids from the mother but together so that they smelled alike, then he blindfolded the mother and let the kids back in with her at the same time. He had a pretty good success rate.

 

[Mark C]

In the case of a dead calf, I have heard of partially skinning it and putting the skin over the back of the orphan.
Yes, it will start to stink within a short time, but the calf will have that smell on it with the hide removed and the transition then goes to the calves own smell.
Just a side note for future reference, it isn’t the case for this situation.

Sorry if this grosses anyone out.

I had a rancher friend who successfully did that with an orphan elk he found caught in his barb-wire fence. They stayed together a lifetime.

PS> He named her "Stinky"...