• Biblical Families is not a dating website. It is a forum to discuss issues relating to marriage and the Bible, and to offer guidance and support, not to find a wife. Click here for more information.

Should a first wife be accepting before...

Status
Not open for further replies.
S

seekHim1

Member
...husband and second wife consummate with intercourse? I'm just curious what men and women's thoughts are on this. Is this a case where the husband can do what he wants and a first wife should just deal with it? Is it just our feministic society nowadays that makes it seem like a first wife should have more say when a husband wants to go into polygyny? Although there were cases in the Bible where the women gave their handmaids to their husbands, I don't believe David checked with his other wives before taking another one.

On the other hand, because we live in a culture where when a woman marries, she does not ever consider polygyny as being part of the package so is that why a husband should be delicate and patient if he makes such a radical, life-changing decision such as polygyny? OR...when a wife marries with the belief that the husband is the head, should she always be ready to submit no matter what and always trust than any decisions her husband makes are for the best and if he is wrong, God will deal with him?
 
This is a very interesting question.
Although I can't speak from experience, I would like to point a few things out. (I'm sorry but I don't have my notes in front of me to provide scripture verses)
First and foremost the Husband is the head of the household. If he sees it best to take another Wife, and add her to the family without telling the first Wife; so be it.
This is where the tricky part comes in though. Since both the Wife and Husband answer to God, the Wife can supersede her Husband and go God for problems. God knows everyone's hearts, and will deal justly.
A Husband should consider all pros/cons before adding another Wife, because It's not to be taken lightly. This is still a life time commitment, and Divorce is still hated by God even in Polygamy.

<------ My personal Opinion -------->
From what I've read, it seems that anytime a Husband considers taking a second Wife the first Wife has to deal with jealously issues.
By no means am I pushing off the issue on the first Wife, and saying "deal with it".
As a loving husband, why would I take another Wife if I can't help my first Wife with something as small as jealously.

Now that said, if it gets to the point where the first Wife is using the "jealously" card to control me, then other issues need to be dealt with.
Polygamy isn't about upgrading or replacing. It's about love, structure, and safety.

The way I see it is a marriage is a machine. The more parts you add, the more complicated it becomes. It may take more work to maintain, but you be able to accomplish a lot more with a polygamous machine than a monogamous machine. It's not for everyone, but that doesn't mean it can't be for anyone.
 
If after you gave your life to Christ to be your Savior, then find out some very heavy news, that He is to be your Lord as well...

Or if a man learns that fornicating with another man is sin...

How should one repent? Does God expect you to go cold turkey, or just use the nicotine patch or gum and cut down to 1 cigarette a day till you quit? (not saying smoking is a sin)

"If an honest man believes a lie, and is revealed the truth, only one of two things can happen. He will no longer believe the lie, or he will no longer be an honest man." - unknown

1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
1Co 13:6 Love..."Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;"

By the Holy Spirit, I believe we know the answers to many of the questions that we ask. We are just looking for something to sooth the hard reality of Truth, like a consolation prize or reparations for following God's ways.
 
seekHim1 said:
...husband and second wife consummate with intercourse? I'm just curious what men and women's thoughts are on this. Is this a case where the husband can do what he wants and a first wife should just deal with it? Is it just our feministic society nowadays that makes it seem like a first wife should have more say when a husband wants to go into polygyny? Although there were cases in the Bible where the women gave their handmaids to their husbands, I don't believe David checked with his other wives before taking another one.

On the other hand, because we live in a culture where when a woman marries, she does not ever consider polygyny as being part of the package so is that why a husband should be delicate and patient if he makes such a radical, life-changing decision such as polygyny? OR...when a wife marries with the belief that the husband is the head, should she always be ready to submit no matter what and always trust than any decisions her husband makes are for the best and if he is wrong, God will deal with him?
Click to expand...

Diasozo answered this question very well from a biblical standpoint. I'd say even if a husband doesn't have to check or get his first wife's approval when bringing another woman into the family, I'd hope that he'd be considerate to discuss it over with his first wife. I mean most husbands should know how any first wife would react if they just brought in another woman without telling the first wife anything. If I were a wife, I'd probably separate (not in the divorce sense) from the husband until the husband started being more considerate.
 
Well. Each couple is different. Refering back to biblical times and how they done it can only be a small role now days. Our societies are nothing a like and things must be adapted to make it work. Now my wifes situation with me and polygamy is different than others but may be the same as some. We are taking on a second. But if the second and my wife do not get along, then whats the point. It will be an unhappy house for a very long time. So as I date, my wife also becomes friends with her. That way theres no sudden stress and a lot of things can be prevented. You must keep the first wife happy and if you cant, then whats the point in taking on a second wife. Again, this works for us and may not for everyone. And not everyone will agree with it but like I said, It works! lol.
 
I don't think there is ANYTHING right about a man taking on another wife without the first wife accepting it. When a man decides he would like to have a poly relationship, and does not tell his wife it is called an affair!! Think about how this affects the love of you life (your first wife). If it wasn't her idea, it will be one of the most painful journeys she may or may not decide to go along with. Regardless of the submitting aspect or whatever, she still has a say of what goes on in her marriage. It's not right, period. It has been said by women on this board time and time again that it is not right. If going into the marriage knowing that your potential husband believes in polygamy, that is a completely different case. I don't usually voice such a strong opinion, but how could a man hurt the woman he promised his life to? No way would I want to marry a man like this.
 
livenotyesterday said:
I don't think there is ANYTHING right about a man taking on another wife without the first wife accepting it.
Click to expand...
A husband technically has no control over a wife, let alone any other human being. If a first wife is absolutely unwilling to accept the idea of PM; he will need to make a hard decision of whats best for the family. Not just the current family, but future family also. From a wife's position this could be a huge break in what she thinks of as trust. It looks like marriage vows are being broken, it could even look like an affair.
However from a biblical stand point the Husband IS the head of the house hold, and if he feels its best to take another Wife without consulting the first Wife... then so be it.

Will it be really hard --- Yes
Will it destroy the current marriage --- It very well could
In the long run is it better for the family --- This is up to the husband, not the wife.

That being said, for me personally I wouldn't want the extra heartache and pain for my Wife. She knows my motives, and has input into me taking a second Wife.
It's like what NCbeleivercouple said: "Each couple is different"
 
Hello

livenotyesterday said:
I don't think there is ANYTHING right about a man taking on another wife without the first wife accepting it.
Click to expand...

I totally understand what you are saying. I would like to suggest that Scripture be our final authority for our faith and practices. Too many times we allow culture to dictate to us what is right or wrong. Techically speaking, Scripture does not address the issue. So, there seems to be liberty here. However, with that being said, Scripture does say that there may be things Lawful, but that doesn't necessarily mean choices based upon liberty are expedient, or that they are the best choices.

We must be careful to distinguish between our views, preferences or convictions vs. Scriptural truth.

When a man decides he would like to have a poly relationship, and does not tell his wife it is called an affair!!
Click to expand...

I would see that "an affair" is an romantic attachment with someone of the opposite sex that does not include marriage.

Think about how this affects the love of you life (your first wife). If it wasn't her idea, it will be one of the most painful journeys she may or may not decide to go along with.
Click to expand...

I would agree in most cases that if there is a secret marriage it will affect be very painful to the other wife/wives involved. So, from my perspective, it is most wise to allow the other wives to be involved. However, it should be noted that in some cultures this is not an issue. Hence, probably the reason that Scripture doesn't make it a mandate for the wife to be involved.

Regardless of the submitting aspect or whatever, she still has a say of what goes on in her marriage. It's not right, period. It has been said by women on this board time and time again that it is not right. If going into the marriage knowing that your potential husband believes in polygamy, that is a completely different case. I don't usually voice such a strong opinion, but how could a man hurt the woman he promised his life to? No way would I want to marry a man like this.
Click to expand...

I agree. Many of us men have not understood the wisdom of what you are saying. This has caused a lot of unnecssary pain. I would just personally take issue with the term "right or worng". To me, Scriptural truth is what is purely right or worong. In our "culture", I would say you are "right"!
 
The original question was " SHOULD a first wife be accepting before; husband and second wife consummate with intercourse?
My answer is "Yes", but from scripture if the question was; "Does the first Wife HAVE to be accepting..." the answer is "No".
As hard as that is, the final decision is decided by the Husband, not the Wife. It's a marriage between him and another woman, not the first wife and another woman.

If she is not, and the husband STILL insists, then I believe she has grounds to divorce him and I would support her if she does.
Click to expand...
According to Jesus, the only time we are permitted to Divorce is if a partner commits Adultery (Not including non-believers)
If the Husband is committing Adultery by taking another mans Wife to marry; then yes the first Wife my Divorce him.
If he is marrying another Wife, that isn't Adultery. His marriage isn't a covenant between; Husband, First Wife, and Second Wife.
He should seek God in prayer and hope that GOD will change His wife's heart and until that time, he should honor his wife and his marriage bed while keeping some discipline and some morality.
Click to expand...
I agree with this. The Husband SHOULD most definitely be praying and seeking God's will. If he is marrying another woman without seeking God, there are other issues, and this isn't what the discussion is about.
Polygamy is not a salvation issue
Click to expand...
It most definitely is a salvation issue, Polygamy is about family and relationships. As the head of the house, the Husband is in charge of teaching and leading his family. That's not to be taken lightly.
In no way should a woman 'submit' to a man who is a liar,an adulter, a bully, etc. and could be endangering her and her children.
Click to expand...
If that man is her husband she should be. If this is the case however she should be praying hourly for God to change his heart and help him. (Again this is another issue)
Ladies, do not be decieved by someone's limited twisted knowledge of certain bible verses.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure who that is directed at, but I take offense. Which part is "twisted"?

Nikki,
These comments aren't directed at you to hurt you. I think you bring up great points.
 
Should a first wife be accepting before a husband adds a second wife ?
Ideally, she "should" but if God is leading a man to marry a second wife and the first wife rejects the idea, then the husband will have to choose whose voice he will listen to.
I will say that I believe it is imperative that any current wife / wives be informed about the possible addition of a new wife, well in advance of the actual marriage occuring. This is the ONLY truly loving and considerate choice a husband can make, especially if the new wife will be residing in the same home with the current wife.
Unfortunately, There are men in the "Patriarchal" community who believe it is perfectly okay to marry any female they want without ever telling their current wife / wives. I know of one man whose first wife doesn't even know how many wives her husband actually has ! I find this very sad. Speaking for myself, I wouldn't be willing to marry any man who wasn't willing to introduce me to his current wife.
Blessings,
Fairlight
 
Fairlight said:
Should a first wife be accepting before a husband adds a second wife ?
Ideally, she "should" but if God is leading a man to marry a second wife and the first wife rejects the idea, then the husband will have to choose whose voice he will listen to.
I will say that I believe it is imperative that any current wife / wives be informed about the possible addition of a new wife, well in advance of the actual marriage occuring. This is the ONLY truly loving and considerate choice a husband can make, especially if the new wife will be residing in the same home with the current wife.
Unfortunately, There are men in the "Patriarchal" community who believe it is perfectly okay to marry any female they want without ever telling their current wife / wives. I know of one man whose first wife doesn't even know how many wives her husband actually has ! I find this very sad. Speaking for myself, I wouldn't be willing to marry any man who wasn't willing to introduce me to his current wife.
Blessings,
Fairlight
Click to expand...

Well said. My happiness as a husband (hypothetically-speaking since I'm not married) is connected with my wife's happiness. I don't think I could ever feel happy if I ever did anything that I know would cause lots of problems to any wife, such as a husband getting a 2nd wife without consent and talking it over with his first wife. I would also think that the 2nd "potential" wife would actually be more considerate than a husband, by wanting to know how the 1st wife feels about having to share her husband, and she (the 2nd "potential" wife) would likely make her decision based on that among other things.

I'm also a bit skeptical about some guys who claim that God reveals to them to take additional wives. It's not unreasonable to consider that lots of guys DREAM about having more than one woman, and at times, I think a man's "strong" fantasies and desires, can lead him to think that God is speaking to him. I'm not saying that God couldn't reveal to a husband to take additional wives, but some should also consider it just oftentimes seem too easy for a man to confuse his own desire to be with more than one woman with being God's voice.

I'll have to agree with Susan B. Anthony here to a certain extent:

I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires. ~ Susan B. Anthony
 
I posted this question but in my own views, I do not see anywhere in Scripture that says a husband has to check with his wife first before taking another wife. However, I think that if a husband truly feels God is calling the family to this kind of living in this day and age, then there are good and not-so-good ways to implement it. If it is implemented in the not-so-good ways, then I think there will be more problems and issues to work through. BUT, when all is said and done, a husband has to lead the family however he sees fit. If a wife knows what God's Word says, then she should take her complaints to the LORD and trust Him with her husband. Even if I don't think my husband is acting appropriately, it is not my place to judge him or tell him he is wrong. And as I am learning, a lot of times I resist my husband's headship in areas that will actually be for my betterment. I am learning to take my complaints to the LORD, but after that, trust that if God doesn't intervene, then I should trust Him that it will work out for my good. This is easier said than done, but I know it is the right way to go about it.
 
I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires. ~ Susan B. Anthony
Click to expand...

"Always"? Coming from a less PC figure in history, a line like that would mark a mere "DWM" as a prejudiced, judgmental jerk.

Spoken like someone who never ONCE had to make an honest decision for Him, and doesn't have enough understanding of what He actually Wrote to know why that "critique" is so self-serving.

I distrust people who know so little about what God wants them to do because they apparently never bothered to read it. I notice that it USUALLY coincides with their own hypocrisy.
 
There is a lot of good stuff on this thread, but I want to remind you all that we are dealing with human beings. Humans make mistakes and they hurt each other. Does that mean that we don't forgive? Does this mean that we have the right to abandon them because they made a mistake?

The Bible says that we are not to get divorced except for "pornea". NEVER is polygamy considered "pornea". Do you think that King David asked his wives for permission to marry each wife that he married?

I am not saying that it is right for a man to bring home a wife as a "surprise" for the existing wife or wives. I am saying that if this happens, it is not necessarily a problem that causes divorce or even a long term grudge.

Forgiveness, Acceptance. Respect your husband. Submit yourself to your husband.

I don't see a scripture that says "Submit when you feel like it" or "Submit as long as he does things your way."

SweetLissa
 
On the actual question of a first wife being "accepting", however, the practical answer is pretty simple in the "general case". Marriage is hard.

(And the 'general level of failure' testifies to the fact that justifiable criticism of the problems associated with "hooking up" extends FAR beyond would-be polygynists.)

Without the wholehearted cooperation of every 'helpmeet', it is far harder still.

It should be noted again as well (and has been pointed out in the past) that those men who have MADE A VOW to "cleave unto her only" have an issue to resolve which MUST be handled properly before proceeding further!


But there is a question here that seems to remain unasked, and unanswered.

(Postscript here: LIssa's post came in during the interim...I agree wholeheartedly. Headship and submission should be two sides of the same coin.)

If a first wife is in rebellion, why would such a husband believe that this marriage is a foundation for taking any further step?

Unless he has an answer for that question directly from Him, and supported by Scripture, the inevitable outcome would seem to be only a matter of time.
 
sweetlissa said:


I don't see a scripture that says "Submit when you feel like it" or "Submit as long as he does things your way."

SweetLissa
Click to expand...

In my humble opinion, I believe there should be an exception to that principle that you mentioned, SweetLissa. If a man is NOT in line with God's will and is ABUSING his wife, especially using religion to do it which has been a problem in the past history and even now in some parts of the world, then I don't think a wife should submit under those circumstances. Contrary to what Mark C thinks, this is what I suspect Susan B. Anthony (a 19th century women's rights advocate) had in mind and probably experienced herself, which is reflected in some of her insights.
 
Susan B Anthony was a feminist.

No a woman should not follow her husband into sin. But if she doesn't believe he is following God, that is not her call. Her husband is the one who have been given headship. Not her.

If a woman is being abused, then of course there are options for her. But to say that she is being abused by religion is ridiculous. When you are told to do something you don't like, you either do it or you don't. If God tells you (or your husband) to do something and you do it, you get blessed. If you choose not to do it then you are in rebellion.

Of course in a perfect world a man will go to the ends of the earth to please his wife. But this is not a perfect world. Many men got here by messing up. Should their wives have left them? Should they not be forgiven for their mistakes?

The Word tells us to forgive as we want to be forgiven.
The Word tells us women to submit to our husbands. (Not when we feel like it)
The Word tells us that men are to love their wives the way Christ loved the church. Lets use the 12 apostles as an example...
Did Christ get their approval before going to a new place?
Did Christ get their approval before inviting a new disciple to join them?
Did Christ get their approval before going to the cross?
Did Christ beg them, plead with them or wait for them to "get it together" before he went on with his mission?

The answer to all of these questions is NO. Did the apostles complain and wonder what had gotten into their Lord and King? Absolutely.

The truth is that WE don't know what God has planned. If we follow Him we will find out and we will be blessed. If we don't follow him we are in Rebellion and we get to deal with that.

SweetLissa
 
I always assume that the general framework of Biblical law indicated what (in general) was best. The existence of "Levirate Law" (the portion of the Law of God as given to and through his prophet Moses that compelled a man to marry his dead brother's wife) says that you just take her as a wife to raise up seed for your brother.

What consultation of the existing wife did this involve? Zero. In fact no one is consulted. Not the widow, not the husband, not the existing wife of the man marrying his brother's widow. You just did it.

Also, if you look at the life example of Gideon who had "many" wives (but was not a "King"), he seemed to have them spread about the area he judged, some living (perhaps) among their parents. See Abimelech. I would say it's entirely possible that Gideon's wives may not have known each other in the sense that they all knew who the others were, and may not have met each other, and quite possibly didn't know or care about the other wives so much. After all, unless that wife was "underfoot" and since there was nothing wrong with having another wife, why would she even care?

Normally, I'd say that all wives knew who the other wives were, and probably had to live nearby or under one roof so a prudent man wouldn't take fire into his cloak and bring in a wife he knew would cause trouble. Culturally, women of this age and in this country are conditioned to think their input matters perhaps a bit more than it should, and that is, what it is. It's not going away. Not in this generation at least.

I'm going to come down on the side that it's none of the wife's business who her husband takes as another wife, unless he deprives her in the ways described in Exodus 21, but a good manager/husband sure doesn't act like a bull in a China Shop. The rather iffy Levite of Judges 19-21 didn't get his concubine to come back with him by speaking harshly to her. In retrospect though, perhaps she would have wished he did.
 
Very good post, Lissa.

There are three basic views concerning husband/wife relationships:

1. Complementarians: The husband and wife are of equal worth before God, but the husband and wife have different functions and responsibilities in marriage. The husband is the head of the home and the wife is his helpmeet.

2. Egalitarians: The husband and wife are in full partnership as equals before God. There is no priority of one spouse over the other.

3. Feminists: The husband and wife are in full partnership as equals before God. However, sometimes the wife may actually lead the home.

Within Complementarianism, there are two categories:

A. Absolute Authoritarinism: The wife is to submit to her husband is ALL THINGS, no matter what he asks her to do.

B. Conditional Authoritarianism: The wife is to submit to her husband in all things unless he asks her to disobey the clear truths of Scripture.

I am convinced that 1.B. is the most Scriptural position, that is, I am a Complementarian that believes that my wife/wives is/are to submit to me unless I am asking her/them to disobey clear Scripture.
 
DaPastor said:
I am convinced that 1.B. is the most Scriptural position, that is, I am a Complementarian that believes that my wife/wives is/are to submit to me unless I am asking her/them to disobey clear Scripture."
Click to expand...
That's a pretty good evaluation Randy, I'd go with 1.B. as well.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top