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Solomon and "patently foolish things"

aineo

aineo

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I teach a Sunday School class at the church I attend, and it seems I often find myself reminding the others in the class that we cannot take our lesson book or its interpretation of the Bible as authoritative. Though I have like this series quite a bit, all too often I find statements of opinion presented as fact. In our lesson tomorrow, the following statement is made:

Still, Solomon would do some patently foolish things—some “Saul-like” acts, as God put it here—such as having 700 wives and worshiping idols.

For reference, the passage this is referring to is 2 Samuel 7:11-17:

2 Samuel 7:11 even from the day that I commanded judges to be over My people Israel; and I will give you rest from all your enemies. The Lord also declares to you that the Lord will make a house for you. 12 When your days are complete and you lie down with your fathers, I will raise up your descendant after you, who will come forth from you, and I will establish his kingdom. 13 He shall build a house for My name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom forever. 14 I will be a father to him and he will be a son to Me; when he commits iniquity, I will correct him with the rod of men and the strokes of the sons of men, 15 but My lovingkindness shall not depart from him, as I took it away from Saul, whom I removed from before you. 16 Your house and your kingdom shall endure before Me forever; your throne shall be established forever.”’” 17 In accordance with all these words and all this vision, so Nathan spoke to David.

Two points:

  1. I do not see that this passage accused Solomon of doing "Saul-like acts," only that the YHWH's lovingkindness would not depart from him as it did Saul.
  2. I am not aware of anywhere in the Bible that Solomon's taking of 700 wives is referred to as foolish. It was certainly foolish that he let himself be led to worship idols because of his wives, and we could debate whether he "multiplied wives" or not, but I do not think it is honest to say that his marrying of 700 wives was "patently foolish."
I am hoping that if I am off base, one of you will point me to the scripture that backs the author's position. Otherwise, tomorrow we may talk about the author's assumptions in Sunday School.
 
I believe you are completely correct. This passage only mentions Saul as a contrast, in that Solomon would never be abandoned like Saul was. It never once hints at any of his behaviour being like Saul's.
Nor do I know of a single passage criticising the number of his wives, just that they led him astray. And he had 1000 wives, the author fails to recognise that "concubines" are just another class of wife.

1 Kings 11 is where Solomon is criticised. It is very clear that he is being criticised firmly for idolatry, nothing to do with the number of his wives. But it does divide his wives into "concubines" and "wives who were princesses", then states that the wives led him astray. This implies that his 300 comcubines did not lead him astray.

Kings from around the world sent their daughters to Solomon to form alliances with him. These became his wives who were "princesses" (of noble birth). So he had 700 foreign wives. In contrast, I expect his concubines were local girls he had chosen because he actually liked them personally or had a practical job for them. Hence the distinction made between his wives, and the fact that we are specifically told the "wives/princesses" led him into idolatry, not the concubines.

So even if the 700 "wives/princesses" were a problem, the 300 concubines are never criticised. The very women the standard Christian reader would initially assume were some sort of immoral mistresses may actually have been his most Godly wives!

Just food for thought depending on how the discussion goes.
 
Patently foolish? By what scriptural standard?

I believe there is debate to be had about "multiplying wives", and we could say that it is implicit judgment from that, but even in this, God focuses on the choices he made by influence of those wives, not the taking of them.

Still don't understand that "patently" usage here. Pretty strong language for so little scriptural backing.
 
Mojo said:
Still don't understand that "patently" usage here. Pretty strong language for so little scriptural backing.
Click to expand...

I agree.
 
It is amazing to me how men who fancy themselves Bible scholars, very careful in forming biblically reasoned lined of thought on many issues, will suddenly throw out all logic when it comes to biblical marriage. They start spouting things like "well, ancient warfare was especially brutal...", "God allowed the sin of polygamy to protect women..."God allowed it, but never condoned it...". My pastor used the "God allowed it to protect women" line, when I talked to hime about it. My response was, really? God allowed polygamy because women were better off in sin then they would have been following God's design?!? He was kind of stumped on that one. it is really hard for me to comprehend sticking to a dogma that I can't defend scripturally. So, back to the original intent of this thread, polygyny being "patently foolish". If that is so, why didn't God say so anywhere in the books of wisdom in the Bible? Also, why did God use the love story of Solomon and his 141st wife to paint a picture of our relationship with Him? Why did God use a analogy with Himself being the husband of multiple wives? Is God "patently foolish"? I would be a little bit terrified going around saying things with such wide sweeping assumptions with no Biblical backing at all
 
Asforme&myhouse said:
It is amazing to me how men who fancy themselves Bible scholars, very careful in forming biblically reasoned lined of thought on many issues, will suddenly throw out all logic when it comes to biblical marriage.
Click to expand...
I discussed plural marriage with a coworker whose son is in pastoral ministry in a large evangelical church. I asked him to discuss it with his son. The son's answer was simply "church leaders are to have one wife, and we should seek to emulate the leaders."

Which begs the questions:
Are believing women to have one wife too?
Are we all supposed to be leaders in the church?
Do all monogamist take turns as leader, since they meet that qualification?

I seem to remeber Romans 12 teaching about a body being many members, but not all the same part...hmmmm. Guess his son forgot that part. Emulation has limits.

Note: not saying I agree with the interpretation regarding "one wife" and leadership qualifications, just bringing it up as part of the discussion. I haven't come to a conclusion on that one in my mind, yet.
 
I have not come to a conclusion on the church leader's "one wife" thing, either. One thing I am pretty sure of is that it isn't referring to polygamy at all. I think it is either refering to not being divorced or that he must have at least one wife. I think both of those can be backed up scripturally.
 
It went well @FollowingHim. When I got to that section, I reminded the class that it is important for us to be sure we are reading and studying the Bible, and we should be careful to not place an author's opinion on the same pedestal as the Bible. I then said that Solomon was never compared to Saul, and the Bible never states having 700 wives was foolish. The only thing the Bible says is that he was led astray to worship foreign gods by his wives, and that was a real issue. I closed that section by stating we need to be careful that we aren't teaching and repeating assumptions as fact. Not a word was said and we moved on. I suppose that is a success.
 
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