The insecurities of a potential second wife

[cmj2231]

As I mentioned in my introductory thread, I am new to the idea of a Poly lifestyle having only seen television shows about it previously until I was approached to be a potential second wife. Prior to my being approached with the idea I didn't think it was for me based on what I saw on television and only having been involved in monogamous relationships in the past but now actually praying through it and getting to know my potential future family, I am feeling more lead to this lifestyle.

The more I am exploring, experiencing, and praying it through though, I realized I do have a few insecurities that I am left with that I didn't previously consider. In the case of my potential family, it wasn't the husband that had the idea of a sister wife it was the first wife. She likes the idea of a second wife (and only a second wife) for multiple and very valid reasons and he was the one that actually needed more convincing on the matter.

The husband and I have had conversations about that and he has said in the past that when she first approached him with the idea he wasn't sure what to think mainly because they have been married for 20 years and to him, she was the only one he had ever wanted and had never considered another woman. Although prior to even meeting me, his mind was changed about the subject and he is all for it now as well; I guess those words have sort of stuck in my mind that she was all he had ever wanted and that he had never considered anyone else. Although he has done his best so far in our courtship to treat me just as fairly and equally and has tried to get to know me for me and enjoys spending time with me, I am still left with some insecurity in terms of how what I can actually offer to him in this relationship.

I know that I have a lot to offer to a future husband in plural marriage or otherwise but if he finds her so great, what could he possibly need from me? I am not trying to compare myself to her in any respect because I know the comparison game is deadly in these relationships and because she and I are two very different people with two very different personalities there really can be no comparison, it would be like comparing apples to oranges-both being fruit and with some similarities but with also many differences. It is more so the thought of "if he already has an apple that he is so in love with, then what interest or need would he have in an orange?" He jokes and says that he likes oranges too, but really, could he ever love and care for me as much as he does for her? Could we ever truly be equal in his eyes with their 20 year background and him not initially wanting anyone but her, or am I just letting my insecurities grow into something bigger than they need to be? I'm praying through it but I am interested to hear thoughts and suggestions from others.

 

[Aussies]

From a mans perspective.(well at least this mans perspective). We have been married for 40 years and I love my wife dearly and your right no one could ever have the same relationship as she and I simply due to the 40 years spent. HOWEVER, for me personally I would gladly get to know another woman with the view of taking her as my own. Look at it from this perspective, when we have a child, our heart is complete toward that child is it not and no other child is like our own. But when another child is born our heart makes plenty of room for both does it not. To my mind the beauty of the relationship is what both the husband and the wife make it. That relationship will be different from any other but just as beautiful.
Take your time. Get to know him and indeed them.
Many years ago one of my mates had a father that had heart problems and he knew that he didn't have long to live and thus he wanted to give some advice to his son about marriage, he said "if you can live without her do so, but if your heart is involved and you can't live without her then take her as your own."
That advice seemed good then and still does today.
Take your time, spent some time and get to know them if its right you will know. Don't try to compare yourself to the first wife for you are not trying to be her, if you can catch his heart and he yours, then your relationship will have its own beauty in its own right.
To my mind it would be a greater concern if he didn't love her as then real trouble would be ahead as the green eyed monster would play havoc.
Take your time, your and indeed his heart needs that time as does the heart of his first wife. enjoy the ride and see where it ends up.
However it works out for you all, it will be right if you take your time.

 

[Lili]

I'm a third wife, and I still struggle with those feelings a lot. Some advice I got from a man in plural marriage was my husband will never be able to make up for 30 years with 1st Wife, and it's pointless to try.

You have your own relationship, and it is new. I'd focus on the fact that you have a relationship with him in the first place. He is going ahead in taking a new wife *for you*, and that isn't a casual proposition. She may have convinced him on the idea, but you are convincing him on the practice. Hey, sister wife teamwork!

 

[Mojo]

I am still left with some insecurity in terms of how what I can actually offer to him in this relationship...

It is more so the thought of "if he already has an apple that he is so in love with, then what interest or need would he have in an orange?" ...

He jokes and says that he likes oranges too, but really, could he ever love and care for me as much as he does for her? ...

Could we ever truly be equal in his eyes with their 20 year background...

You offer him yourself, your devotion, your submission. That's all you have control over.

What's love got to do with it? Be more concerned with his actions that show love to you and her. Men of Christ are called to love by serving and sacrificing. That's what you should be looking for, not pink hearts and roses.

He doesn't necessarily have to be equal, he needs to be just (fair) and that isn't always equal. You will never be equal anyway. She already has twenty years with him. It couldn't even begin to be equal until she dies and you live with him twent years more, but you don't want that do you?

 

[Joleneakamama]

I have long thought that the man who is satisfied with what he has is at least as good a candidate for plural marriage, as a man who has wandering eyes, and is wishing for someone else.

A woman who causes a happily married man see her as an asset to his family, should view that as no minor accomplishment!

My hubby had to study polygyny, be darned sure it was biblical, and then realize that me being ok with it was unusual, but not abnormal. He would NEVER share me, so couldn't personally relate to my willingness to share him. Only after working through all that, was he was able to contemplate the upsides, and process the idea in a more personal way. He would still be cautious, and take it slow, and would probably be pretty choosy.

I suspect a lot of happily martied men would be this way. This is why I think you should consider it a high compliment if he is working on developing a relationship with you.

As others have said, he can not take back the years he's had with his current wife, but if he (and his family) are willing to let you change their family, and be part of the rest of their lives, they really couldnt offer more.

Doubt will kill any marriage, so keep praying yourself through, until you are sure of your course.
Sounds like you're on the right track to me.

 

[aineo]

First off, I really appreciate that you are exploring yourself as you are considering this. In a thread that is similar in topic, I wrote something that applies here too:

The question has been asked elsewhere if this long love places newer wives at a disadvantage? I don't think so. Sure, a long tenured wife likely has a strong bond that cannot be mimicked, but a newer wife is also going to build her own bond that also cannot be mimicked.​

 

[FollowingHim2]

When Samuel and I got married I wanted 6 kids. He wanted 3. We settled on 4 probably being the optimum number.
We now have 6 children with a 7th on the way.
Does this mean that any children after number 3 should feel that their father doesn't really love them and didn't really want them?
Perhaps number 7 should feel that both of us don't want him and he isn't really an asset to our lives because I previously wanted to stop at 6?
Or then there's the fact that when I got pregnant with number 6 I had a 3 month old baby and literally freaked out over the fact that I was going to have them so close together. Should she feel she wasn't wanted?

All of my children are different and they all bring something new and exciting and valuable to our family. How can 6 children from the same two parents be so vastly different? I don't know, only YHWH knows. Yet they are all loved as much as each other. Our plans changed, and that's OK.

When we got married we planned for it to be only Samuel and I for the rest of our lives. We couldn't see how things would change and that we would be open to him having another wife. It was YHWH that opened our eyes. Samuel's love for another woman won't be any less than his love for me.

I know the whole idea of PM is a pretty crazy concept at first. You wonder why one woman is just not enough. It messes with your head because of the society we live in and everything we've been brought up to believe. Society tells us we should have only 2 or 3 children too, any more is a burden and isn't wanted. Yet we have found such great satisfaction in having our children, and we would never change it. There are positives that people with smaller families just don't see. In the same way there are positives in PM that others don't see.

You're playing a numbers game in your head. One should be enough. He said one was enough. Two isn't needed, too many. You're missing the fact that this has nothing to do with numbers at all. It's about relationships. It's about expanding the family. It's about love. It's about following YHWH. It's about the fact that you are such an incredibly wonderful person that he wants you as well. Rather than that being a bad thing, that should be a huge compliment.

 

[Mojo]

As I mentioned in my introductory thread, I am new to the idea of a Poly lifestyle having only seen television shows about it previously until I was approached to be a potential second wife. Prior to my being approached with the idea I didn't think it was for me based on what I saw on television and only having been involved in monogamous relationships in the past but now actually praying through it and getting to know my potential future family, I am feeling more lead to this lifestyle.

The more I am exploring, experiencing, and praying it through though, I realized I do have a few insecurities that I am left with that I didn't previously consider. In the case of my potential family, it wasn't the husband that had the idea of a sister wife it was the first wife. She likes the idea of a second wife (and only a second wife) for multiple and very valid reasons and he was the one that actually needed more convincing on the matter.

The husband and I have had conversations about that and he has said in the past that when she first approached him with the idea he wasn't sure what to think mainly because they have been married for 20 years and to him, she was the only one he had ever wanted and had never considered another woman. Although prior to even meeting me, his mind was changed about the subject and he is all for it now as well; I guess those words have sort of stuck in my mind that she was all he had ever wanted and that he had never considered anyone else. Although he has done his best so far in our courtship to treat me just as fairly and equally and has tried to get to know me for me and enjoys spending time with me, I am still left with some insecurity in terms of how what I can actually offer to him in this relationship.

I know that I have a lot to offer to a future husband in plural marriage or otherwise but if he finds her so great, what could he possibly need from me? I am not trying to compare myself to her in any respect because I know the comparison game is deadly in these relationships and because she and I are two very different people with two very different personalities there really can be no comparison, it would be like comparing apples to oranges-both being fruit and with some similarities but with also many differences. It is more so the thought of "if he already has an apple that he is so in love with, then what interest or need would he have in an orange?" He jokes and says that he likes oranges too, but really, could he ever love and care for me as much as he does for her? Could we ever truly be equal in his eyes with their 20 year background and him not initially wanting anyone but her, or am I just letting my insecurities grow into something bigger than they need to be? I'm praying through it but I am interested to hear thoughts and suggestions from others.

How's it going for you? Have you addressed this with your potential SW or anyone else? Were you able to discuss on Ladies chat? Just checking. There's lots of support here. God bless.

 

[cmj2231]

Thanks for checking back in on me Mojo, it is appreciated as is everyone else's feedback here. I really appreciated the insight that everyone brought and it helped me to see things a little differently in that they might have their 20 year marriage but the love that he and I will share will be different but hopefully just as special but for other reasons and in other ways and that is okay. I appreciate the perspective that was shared about comparing it to children and not loving one or the other child less but having room in your heart for both as a parent and loving them equally as much but for different reasons. I also appreciated the thought of seeing it as a compliment that he may want me too instead of questioning my value in it. All of that helped a lot and provided some initial reassurance.

I would have to be honest though and say that my initial reassurance has been a bit shaky lately and I've continued to pray through things and trust in God and not just rely on feelings because my feelings have been all over the map to be honest because several things have happened since I have last posted that leave me questioning so much. I live in one state and my potential family lives in the state below me. I had been driving almost three hours every week to spend a few days with them and then go back to my home, which was quite a trek but well worth the drive to be able to get to know them and really try to see what life would be like there. I made this drive a few weeks ago as usual and spent the weekend there and during that weekend, my potential future husband and I spent a lot of time together because my potential Sister Wife was at work and the kids were occupied with other things. I treasured this time with him and getting to know him more.

On the last night I was there during that trip, he took our relationship to a more physically intimate level and held me and kissed me and I was okay with that and nothing progressed beyond that point (as it shouldn't!) but I couldn't help feeling badly about it afterwards. It is that moment that led me to think of the thoughts contained in my initial post in this thread about what I would have to offer him when he was already so enamored with her and for some reason after it happened, on my drive back to my house, I felt guilty, like I had betrayed her somehow, I wasn't sure why I was feeling so guilty and that sense of betrayal but I was. I then learned a couple of days later that he told my potential sister wife what happened between us. I learned from her that he told her. I think he only told her because she asked him because in a group message she said something like "I wouldn't have even known had I not asked..." She said that she felt betrayed, felt in a way like she was cheated on and felt it hard to trust. She said that she expected us to come and have a conversation with her before things went to any physical level so we could have all had a conversation about it. She said that she wanted to feel more involved in that decision and she felt robbed that she wasn't and she even said that before any type of physical contact she would have required testing from me (in terms of medical testing) to be sure I was "safe" (she is a nurse) and in some ways I can understand where she is coming from with that, but I felt like my character was insulted with that statement. She said that she really wanted to make this work but in the moment she felt betrayed and that this would take a while for her to get over. We agreed to continue to limit things only to kissing and hugging (which is what this was to begin with) and not to do anything more without a conversation with her first (not that we would anyway, we want to keep all other things for marriage).

As I mentioned, I was already feeling my own guilt and sense of betrayal after it happened, and I was also feeling insecure and non-comparable to her after it happened as well and her "vomiting" on me on two separate occasions in regards to this incident only made me feel worse. I felt like "Sally Home-Wrecker" or something and I felt even more awful than I did before she expressed her feelings about it, and it left me not only feeling insecure about my relationship with him but also with her and I felt blamed for the entire incident. I apologized to her, agreed to things on her terms (as mentioned before), and told her I would do what I could to try to help her to heal from this (meanwhile my own feelings in the matter have gone unheard and unsupported). I would also be dishonest if I didn't say that I didn't feel a little betrayed by him as well. I had no idea that he was going to share such things about the intimate details of our relationship with her regardless of whether or not she had asked him. None of us had prior conversations as to how much and what we were going to share with each other, but apparently the answer is almost everything... I also felt a little betrayed that he did not take accountability in our group conversation for what had happened as well (only in side conversations with me and her privately). I took accountability for my part, and he was quiet for the most part and just let her lash out at me for what had happened. I felt hurt to say the least and it made me wonder if in the future he was just going to take her side in things and not acknowledge my feelings at all.

Since then things have gotten better between me and my potential sister wife and we have been able to rekindle our friendship for the most part, we haven't really discussed the incident further and I know there are still some underlying feelings on both ends but neither of us have brought them up because at this point we are trying to just let them go and move forward instead of dwelling on negative things. What has changed a lot though is my relationship with my potential husband. I talked with him and he said that he made a poor choice in the incident and that he hurt her really badly and wanted her and I to focus on rebuilding our relationship but he never acknowledged my feelings in the mix either and how he let me take the brunt of it all during our group discussion. I also told him that I didn't want things to become strange between he and I because of what had happened and he agreed. Despite his agreement however, things have become REALLY strange.

He used to try to spend time with me but now it is like I am his last priority after his job, work on the farm, the kids, and her, and then it is me... I see him maybe 15 minutes a day. I expected there to be less contact with him than in a monogamous relationship because this is a poly relationship but I didn't expect it to be such little time. It is like he isn't even trying and I often feel like an afterthought to him. It almost feels like he is not even making an effort to spend time with me or get to know me anymore.

I recently began a new job in their area and so am in the process of moving there and have been spending weekdays in their area while I commute on weekends back to my house in the other state to pack to move completely by the end of the month so he has daily access to me but as mentioned, I only get 15 minutes a day alone with him if that, and it is not even quality time, he often just talks about the weather or generic topics like that. During times when he is physically close (hugs or kisses me, as we agreed with my potential sister wife) he will quickly pull away and even walk away if she walks into the room. I get it- he is trying to be respectful of her and her feelings, but meanwhile I am beginning to feel lost in this entire thing and feeling as though I'm not important. They want me to feel like a member of the family while I am there, but how can I when I am treated like a simple roommate? I don't want to be in a loveless, unappreciated relationship like some of the monogamous relationships I have been in, and it seems like this is headed that way. Instead of this being something exciting and something I am looking forward to as new, and wonderful beginnings for my future, I am having doubts, and am worried that I am moving here and giving up life as I know it for something that doesn't leave me feeling valued. If anything I am feeling sad and wondering if this truly is where I am supposed to be. I don't want to base this decision on feelings because feelings can be fleeting and can be overwhelming and not accurately representative of the full situation so I am just praying for guidance, but I can't ignore my feelings completely in the matter. I want this to work and I am trying but I am not always good at expressing my emotions and feelings in conversation, mainly because I grew up in a family where my feelings were always discredited, so I'm not sure how to manage this. I also am trying to be respectful of her and her feelings and even though I want more attention and time from him, I don't want to demand it because I don't want to dredge up some of the feelings that she and I are trying to move forward from. I get it, SHE is his wife right now, but does that mean her feelings are greater or more important than mine? Does that mean that by default she gets more time with him? I'm sorry for venting, but I just feel overwhelmed with it all in the moment and am wondering if I am making the right decision with this family and even this lifestyle...

 

[Mojo]

Whew! Lots to tackle there.
Full disclosure: I am not a practitioner of PM.

Since I am not a practitioner, my first suggestion is to continue to consult with those on this site who are.

From a male perspective, though, your husband must feel like the baby in that story with Solomon. He must feel like he is going to be split in two in trying to navigate the waters between you two. But, this is his fitness test. If he fails it now, it doesn't mean he is unfit forever, just in need of more training in knee bends (prayer).

Likewise, if your future SW isn't reacting in a way you feel comfortable with, remember that this is new for her also. She may not be fit now, but it doesn't mean she won't be in the future.

Pray, discern the spirits, be wise as a serpent.

On a side note: I have heard that some involved in PM do not engage in any type of PDA in front of a SW. I don't know if that's necessary or effective since I am not a practitioner ( did I mention that? )

 

[mystic]

CMJ, that sounds like a very straight-up, non-blaming report. You and SW each have some hurt feelings, and DH (Dear Husband) will do well to attend to them. Worth noting that nobody's objected to proceeding, just that feelings need to be minded. A test for DH indeed.

 

[andrew]

Mojo, that's pretty sage advice for a non-practitioner....

No PDA in front of a SW sounds boring to me, but to each his own. I can't keep my hands off of 'em....

cmj, just to piggyback on what Mojo and mystic have already said, plan on the next few years giving all of you a major reorientation re what Christianity's all about. Focus on love and forgiveness and honesty and acceptance more than what you think is the right and wrong of it. Your husband got a little ahead of himself, now everybody's reacting to the event and then reacting to others' reactions.

All three of y'all should agree now that you're going to love each other through the mistakes, and take each glitch as an opportunity for some fresh, open communication about what you want to do differently in the future, rather than who messed up and whose fault it is and what the punishment is going to be. Not to scare you, but what just happened will be laughed at later as insignificant compared to some of the things you have yet to work out.

I mean that in the same sense that parents of six or eight or more children chuckle at younger parents who think they 'have their hands' full with, say, three kids. Or you can look back at your life as, say, a teenager, and just gotta laugh at some of the things that seemed so important to you back then.

I strongly recommend the book Language and the Pursuit of Happiness for anyone who wants to improve their communication skills.

Final thought: Having the first wife oversee the development of the intimacy between husband and second wife is problematic, or maybe I should say can be problematic, or is problematic in my experience, in case there's someone out there that that worked for. In any event, that's not my family's story, and in a handful of cases I'm familiar with that strategy creates structural problems.

 

[FollowingHim2]

Just a wee note here to say that if you read cmj's introduction you'll see that the family she's involved with are not Christians. That seems to be an assumption people are making.
I'll comment more later if I have time, but just briefly now I'll say I thoroughly agree with everything Andrew said.

 

[Mojo]

Just a wee note here to say that if you read cmj's introduction you'll see that the family she's involved with are not Christians. That seems to be an assumption people are making.
I'll comment more later if I have time, but just briefly now I'll say I thoroughly agree with everything Andrew said.

Yikes! You're right. I remember her now. I did encourage her to read the entire website and have her potential family read it because we are a Christian based community.

CMJ, what you are going to be receiving from us on here may be like trying to learn Chinese in a week. It just may not translate to your situation very easily. Even if we aren't all in a PM, most on here are monogamous in a Christ-centered marriage. It makes a HUGE difference.

 

[Joleneakamama]

Life and learning are rarely simple, and polygyny is new territory for everyone at some point, which is why people who speak from successful experience, like Andrew, are so respected.

Andrew wrote something recently to the effect that if you have a biblical marriage to begin with, scaling it up with another wife, or even more, is easier to do, but that flaws in the foundation of a monogamous marriage will show up when you try to add another wife.

Some are looking for a marriage in which each member has equal authority or say in decisions and such. Many want the man to be the head of the household, and take responsibility for leading the family, and most women want a man who's judgement they can trust.

I doubt many first wives would want to give control of their relationship with their husband to the new wife coming in, and I also doubt that a woman would take a man seriously who let his mother (or any other woman) run his life. I think a woman who claims to want a sisterwife should really think about how much she trusts her husband, because meddling or trying to oversee his new relationship is probably overlooking, or not considering, the effect that would have on her, if she were the new woman. Or in other words she could be being hypocritical, having a double standard, or forgetting the golden rule.

I smiled at Andrew's comment about pda's in front of a sisterwife, because I think it's a sign of a healthy loving relationship, and should not make a secure wife, who also gets to enjoy that kind of affection jealous, but rather happy for what they have with each other.
I mean seriously, who ever runs out of kisses, or love? It's not like there isn't enough to go around!

I agree with Mojo, that just because you are having to work through things, or as he put it 'they aren't fit now,' doesn't mean they (and even you) cannot learn, and overcome these difficulties.

It sure can be tough though, and only you can decide on what is doable, and what are deal breakers.

I pray God gives you wisdom, and helps you see them, and the life ahead of you all, from a higher perspective, as only He knows the end from the beginning.

Thank you for letting us share your journey!

 

[Aussies]

CMJ, Firstly may I just say thank you for both poring your heart out and exposing your feelings to us. You sound like a lovely young woman and I personally feel honored that you are trusting us as you have. In times of stress we all need someone to talk to that can understand and yet is not personally involved. And may I also add that I think every wife that is in a position to possibly become a sister wife should read your heartfelt comments for this is no game, and we often only see things from one side and the perspective of an existing wife is different from a prospective wife. again thank you!

I also am not PM. But with your permission I would like to just ask a couple of questions.

If he were a single man and she was his mother, how would you expect "him" to react?
Is he displaying a solid lead in the family unit, in other words is he in control or is he being led by the nose?
Are you happy with the way he is protecting you from "danger"?
Do "they" really want another wife?
How would any courting couple conduct themselves?
If you have conducted yourself just like any other courting couple, then why should you feel bad in yourself?


I might be wrong but as I see it your personal relationship with him is the same as any monogamous relationship when you are with him, its polygamous when you are altogether. I know that statement will possibly gain some criticism. But the relationship between you and he is just that , between you and he.
He is ready for a poly relationship, and she is ready for a poly relationship, but are "they" ready?

Again I am talking from the top of my hat, but as I see it he needs to be the head of his house and each wife needs to be submissive to that headship and no wife should be less than the other. Admittedly, at this point you are only courting but nothing magical is going to happen once you commit to this union. What you want to see in a husband in the future is what you need to see in him now.

I am not saying to bail, but you and he need to have an in-depth talk and then you need to see if and how he takes control of both the situation and his family.
Its not up to you and its not up to her, its his headship and thus his responsibility to keep you all safe and happy.

After all they "both" invited you, thus you are the guest not an intruder. As you were invited in, you are not the threat to this union, the "issue" is theirs not yours.

Anyway that's what I would tell you if you were my daughter.

 

[Sonshine]

So, I am absolutely not an expert in the area of polygyny. Even though my family will be (kind of is) polygynous soon, I am so new at this and make so many mistakes that I feel so inferior giving you any sort of advice or help. But, my heart tell me that you're hurting right now and that makes me very sad for you. So, if anything I say is wrong, I'm going off faith that someone much wiser than I am will correct it.

Right now, my husband is engaged to a wonderful woman who will be his second wife and my SW very soon. I have severely mixed feelings about this and am working on my heart right now.

I can tell you as a first wife, I can understand what your potential SW is going through. And without a strong husband to lead her, she may never feel the need to try to change any of the issues she has. But, also, just remember, the beginning of this journey is going to be difficult. I absolutely adore my husband's fiancee, but even with that, I find that this whole situation brings about an ugliness in myself, that left unchecked, could ruin everyone's happiness and obedience to God.

One of the things you said, I feel really needs addressing...

I want this to work and I am trying but I am not always good at expressing my emotions and feelings in conversation, mainly because I grew up in a family where my feelings were always discredited, so I'm not sure how to manage this. I also am trying to be respectful of her and her feelings and even though I want more attention and time from him, I don't want to demand it because I don't want to dredge up some of the feelings that she and I are trying to move forward from.

You have to be able to tell your potential family what you need. I know others have already stressed the point of communication, but this is really important. If you can't tell the man you're dating that you need more from him, there's a problem. And by you telling him that you need more attention, alone time, or whatever, you're not doing anything wrong.

You're right about the fact that because this isn't a monogamous relationship things won't be the same for you as they would be without the wife there--but that doesn't mean you aren't entitled to some attention and time (even alone) with your potential husband. You shouldn't feel guilty about it either.

Also, I understand the wife's feelings of betrayal. But, it doesn't necessarily mean they are valid. Our feelings do lie to us. My feelings all the time tell me that any time my husband goes off with his fiancee I need to concern myself with what's going on or be hurt by what they're doing. In all honesty, though, just like you shouldn't concern yourself with their relationship, she shouldn't be concerning herself with yours. It's up to your potential husband to be concerned with each of these relationships.
This isn't where your potential SW is at yet, however. And it may take awhile...But, that needs to be where she's trying to get to.

Try to have patience with her. She will need constant forgiveness and love. And be patient with your potential husband, also. As others have said this is new for him, too. He will make mistakes. You all will.

 

[cmj2231]

Whew! Lots to tackle there.
Full disclosure: I am not a practitioner of PM.

Since I am not a practitioner, my first suggestion is to continue to consult with those on this site who are.

From a male perspective, though, your husband must feel like the baby in that story with Solomon. He must feel like he is going to be split in two in trying to navigate the waters between you two. But, this is his fitness test. If he fails it now, it doesn't mean he is unfit forever, just in need of more training in knee bends (prayer).

Likewise, if your future SW isn't reacting in a way you feel comfortable with, remember that this is new for her also. She may not be fit now, but it doesn't mean she won't be in the future.

Pray, discern the spirits, be wise as a serpent.

On a side note: I have heard that some involved in PM do not engage in any type of PDA in front of a SW. I don't know if that's necessary or effective since I am not a practitioner ( did I mention that? )

I fully appreciate your opinions and suggestions even though you are not a practitioner Mojo, and certainly appreciate the male perspective. I am a very analytical person and my career is in psychology so I'm always trying to think of things objectively and from other people's perspectives, but when you are in the midst of the situation it is hard to maintain that objectivity which is why I ask for thoughts and opinions here. I am definitely praying and trying to discern and trying not to base anything on feelings and I do like the reminder that you give that this is new for them and just because it isn't a fit now does not mean that it won't be in the future.

I'm not sure that I would agree completely about no PDA in front of a SW. I can see where it may cause jealousy but at the same time I think there would also be some level of expectation that a husband would want to show affection to both of his wives, or even in the situation here sometimes where he or one of us is going out the door for work, he will kiss us good-bye, either both of us if he is leaving, or the one of us that is leaving... well or should I say he used to be better at this, I noticed lately if she is in the same room with us he has begun to refrain, or will only kiss me on the cheek instead of the lips which is completely unlike him and his previous behavior.

 

[cmj2231]

CMJ, that sounds like a very straight-up, non-blaming report. You and SW each have some hurt feelings, and DH (Dear Husband) will do well to attend to them. Worth noting that nobody's objected to proceeding, just that feelings need to be minded. A test for DH indeed.

Yes, no one has objected to proceeding and we are trying to make this work but the feelings do need to be minded, and although I've tried to just present it like it is, the truth is, there are some feelings still lingering between all of us and in my position it seems that the feelings that are minded the most right now are hers and mine have been tossed to the wayside. I have told them both a bit about my feelings regarding the "incident" but they were overlooked because of her feelings in the moment, and the appeasing of her feelings in the situation has caused him to push me away almost too much and now I am feeling unvalued and like my feelings and opinions don't matter as much. I don't know that he can mind the feelings of both of us because he hasn't done well to so far. Even in simple things like asking him for more time with him he will say that summer time is busiest for him because of his business and things he needs to do on the farm or he will direct me to spend more time with her, not realizing that his neglecting to spend time with me is just pushing me away and making me feel unprioritized and unwanted. How can I ever fully enter a courtship with him if he is not making time to get to know my heart? He spends most of his day with her, most of his time when they are away texting her, and at night he sleeps in her bed (as he should because they are married). I get 15 minutes or less time with him a day and as I mentioned before it isn't always quality time and that certainly does not equate to getting to know each other better at all, nor does it make me feel secure in him.

 

[FollowingHim]

I too am writing as a monogamist:

She said that she expected us to come and have a conversation with her before things went to any physical level so we could have all had a conversation about it. She said that she wanted to feel more involved in that decision and she felt robbed that she wasn't

The first time I kissed my wife, I hadn't planned to. I had no idea I was going to. It was just a spontaneous thing that happened because it was the time for it to happen. I can pretty well guarantee the same was the case when he first kissed her, and will be the same for me and a second wife should that ever occur. That's how relationships work. They aren't planned with detailed conversations and decisions before every little step. She is expecting something completely unfair because she is expecting him to treat you completely differently to how he treated her, and to treat you completely unnaturally.

and she even said that before any type of physical contact she would have required testing from me (in terms of medical testing) to be sure I was "safe" (she is a nurse)

That however is a reasonable expectation prior to sex, because disease transmission does affect her so this is a legitimate area of concern for her. Technically disease transmission can also come through kissing, so she could argue that it could be stretched this far, but most diseases that are spread through kissing can also be spread through sneezing, so if you try drawing the line here it just becomes ridiculous. Drawing the line at kissing is an excuse to control him, not a legitimate medical concern.

I apologized to her, agreed to things on her terms (as mentioned before), and told her I would do what I could to try to help her to heal from this (meanwhile my own feelings in the matter have gone unheard and unsupported)

There was nothing to apologise for. Neither you or he did anything wrong. You didn't have an agreement with her that you would ask her about this first, she just expected that in her own mind. Things didn't go as she expected - but that is nobody's fault. She had insecurities she had failed to let you know about. That is her problem, not yours.

Her terms are unreasonable, and it's not her job to set terms for your relationship anyway.

When difficulties like this occur, those with quiet personalities that dislike conflict can tend to take the easy route of assuming responsibility and apologising even when something was not their fault. Sometimes that is a good approach to calm a difficult situation, but must be done with caution. Because often it is counterproductive, because it leaves the other party believing that their viewpoint is entirely correct, and they'll then solidify that viewpoint and move further into it.

It sounds like this woman is looking for a single "polygamous marriage" where you are "marrying" both her and him as a couple and therefore she gets a say in everything because everything is to do with her. We're all looking at it from the perspective that he has one marriage with her, is pursuing a second marriage with you, each is essentially a monogamous marriage (there just happen to be two of them) and neither marriage is the other wife's business. And the husband is in charge. This is the biblical model, and it works. What they have in mind may be a different arrangement, that may not be workable. More likely they just haven't thought about the issues of authority, responsibility and privacy very deeply at all, and have just been sleepwalking into the mess you now find yourself caught up in.

Be glad however that this has come up now, you now have the opportunity to work through some very deep and important issues around family structure and authority that are essential to work through prior to marriage.