What constitutes as adultery in the Bible?

[PolyPride]

I was given a website by someone here to read about and it had some interesting points. It seems that what would constitute as adultery and fornication would be based on what constitutes as sex in the Bible. It just seems that there are a lot of things that people would call adultery or cheating that I don't find a biblical reference to, and if it's not referenced then it's not necessarily prohibited. I will base my questions off of typical erogenous zones (areas of the body that can lead to sexual arousal, lips, tongue, neck, male and female genitalia, etc.) in both men and women. With that said, I'll get straight to the questions.

According to the Bible, what is sex?

If a married man kisses a married or single woman on the lips or any other erogenous zone, is that adultery or a biblically based reason to leave your spouse?
If a married woman kisses a married or single man on the lips or any other erogenous zone, is that adultery or a biblically based reason to leave your spouse?

More involved questions.. We all know that there are different acts that we call "sex" nowadays, so all of my questions below will reference non-penile acts of intercourse.

If a married person (wife or husband) performed a sexual act that doesn't involve sexual intercourse on someone they're not married to, would that constitute as adultery or a biblically based reason to leave that spouse?

PS, I would not do any of these actions myself nor would I advocate for them, but I just want to know what the Bible says about these issues, esp. when it comes to what a married man can do while courting a woman who is single.

 

[Mark C]

[emphasis added for clarity]

If a married man kisses a married or single woman on the lips or...whatever...is that adultery or a biblically based reason to leave your spouse?

But - to the question - I submit that the Bible is both clear, and broad:

What does become "one flesh" (in the original Hebrew, if there is any doubt) mean?

What does "lust in the heart" mean?

The answer is an individual one on some level -- because He knows the heart. A study of the "remedy for the jealous husband" in Numbers 5 is extremely illuminating in this regard: most of the time, there will NOT be "two or three witnesses", but He has given us this text NOT so much as a "remedy", but a teaching about FORGIVENESS. History teaches that most of the time, when this method was employed, there was reported to be confession, repentance, forgiveness, and reconciliation BEFORE anything actually had to be drank!

 

[PolyPride]

The very first line is sufficient to realize that -- unless the question is corrected to be consistent with the Bible -- there may well be a problem with what follows:

[emphasis added for clarity]

If a married man kisses a married or single woman on the lips or...whatever...is that adultery or a biblically based reason to leave your spouse?

There are SO many distortions in that one question alone [which most here will no doubt recognize] that the author does "more harm than good" to any message which follows but muddying up the waters at the start.

I honestly don't see how my questions are distorted, Mark. If you feel the need to put me or my views down, then please don't bother responding to any of my posts just as me and you talked about before.

But - to the question - I submit that the Bible is both clear, and broad:

What does become "one flesh" (in the original Hebrew, if there is any doubt) mean?

What does "lust in the heart" mean?

The answer is an individual one on some level -- because He knows the heart. A study of the "remedy for the jealous husband" in Numbers 5 is extremely illuminating in this regard: most of the time, there will NOT be "two or three witnesses", but He has given us this text NOT so much as a "remedy", but a teaching about FORGIVENESS. History teaches that most of the time, when this method was employed, there was reported to be confession, repentance, forgiveness, and reconciliation BEFORE anything actually had to be drank!

Mark C, you did not answer my questions but just made critiques. If I ask a question, I hope to get an answer, not more questions or explanations that don’t answer the questions. Please tell me what exactly constitutes as "sex" in the Bible. For instance, is oral sex, sex or is only sexual intercourse sex. The words, "one flesh" in a sense means "sex" but what kind of sex is the question.

Lets take Numbers 5:12-13 which talks about the jealous husband. Those verses have to do with adultery, and does not answer the question of what sex is, and let me add that kissing is not sex.

Regarding your lusting in the heart comment, let me ask if a married man dates a "single" woman, is he not entitled to do to her all that I mentioned in my original questions that you distorted? Since a married man can date a potential second wife, I'm assuming they'd kiss, lust in his heart, and more perhaps.
I'd also add that kissing can be done without lusting, and even some of the other acts involved in the other questions that I asked. Some people may do it just to do it without a passionate desire for the other person.. Either way, if all of these people were married, would they be committing acts that would give biblical warrant for their spouse to leave them?

Extra: I’d say a married man may be able to have sex with a single unbetrothed woman but then he has to marry her.

 

[Mark C]

But - to the question - I submit that the Bible is both clear, and broad:

What does become "one flesh" (in the original Hebrew, if there is any doubt) mean?

What does "lust in the heart" mean?

...

"one flesh" is a common translation referring to "sexual intercourse", which often results in procreation, or one NEW flesh.

To "lust in the heart" is a reference to just about ANYTHING else which leads there - from kissing to petting to fantasy, or "coveting".

 

[PolyPride]

Kissing does not have to lead to sex, especially "sexual intercourse" or a "sexual or passionate desire" for the person. There are also plenty of guys and girls who have sex (intercourse or otherwise) without having a passionate desire or really wanting the person; they just do it, just to do it (try attending a frat party where things like this are done just for fun). I know people who've done that, but I suppose this all depends on the individual. I was also wondering if all of these non-sexual intercourse acts established a biblical reason for a spouse to divorce another spouse but I can figure out the rest now that I know what "sex" is according to the Bible. This would also be relevant for married guys who court single women.

I was also thinking that if immoral coveting and lusting are defined in terms of adultery which involves "sex", whether it be physically or desiring it in the heart, then someone may not be committing adultery, if they desired or did an act with a person, that is not sexual intercourse related.

 

[CecilW]

First of all, Angel3, while MarkC sometimes get carried away on what he thinks is being asked, he's never intentionally sarcastic or pejorative. So please accept my apologies, if they're needed, on his behalf. He's a good guy.

Second, I found a really relevant article at http://www.righteouswarriors.com/contro ... cle11.html . It might be helpful.

Third, that same site, in other articles, discusses adultery vs. fornication as well or better than I've ever seen. It points out that sex between any other man and a married woman is adultery, but between a married man and an unmarried woman is the start of a marriage -- NOT adultery. And therefore not grounds for a wife to leave.

Fourth, I see an application here to Steve's recent post that with sex, the marriage is "conceived". It is then carried to term and burst into life, or is aborted.

This brings us back to a kiss or a caress. I think we all know that there are kisses, and there are KISSES! Same with caresses. I attend a very affectionate church in S. Florida, and both hug and kiss numerous women (and men, though without the kiss), both single and married, at any given service. Often in the presence of, and just before or just after their husbands. No question of impropriety or eroticism arises.

On the other hand, some years ago at our dining table we held hands for grace. Afterwards my 12 year old daughter told my wife that she didn't want to have to do that with one of our guests any more. It later turned out that he WAS harboring erotic thoughts toward my daughter (and ceased to be welcome at our table, of course.)

In other words, folks can tell. Even kids.

Putting all that together, what I come up with in answer to your question goes something like this. A kiss between a man and woman, both married but not to each other, COULD be innocuous, as described above.

On the other hand, it COULD be the conception of the sex act, i.e. a step of "foreplay", which could, of course, be carried all the way to fruition or aborted.

Now, if you got pregnant 3 times but aborted 2, how many times have you been pregnant? So, as my personal best estimate, with which you are free to disagree, tis best not to engage in the first steps recognizable as foreplay in an inappropriate relationship.

However, does having done so constitute grounds for divorce? I'll leave that to the individual conscience, as it isn't clearly spelled out in black and white in scripture. (And if it were, folks would be trying to figure a way around it!)

 

[PolyPride]

Thanks for the response, Cecil. The website you posted is actually the same one I'm referring to but I read a different article, which was on polygyny and adultery. In a church or formal atmosphere I can relate to what you're talking about, but in less formal areas like college parties, bars, flirtatious friends, things are often done all in the name of fun, but I do agree with you it can lead to more both in feeling and actual acts that would constitute as adultery or fornication.

I was also thinking that if immoral coveting and lusting are defined in terms of adultery which involves "sex", whether it be physically or desiring it in the heart, then someone may not be committing adultery, if they desired or did an act with a person, that is not sexual intercourse related.

 

[CecilW]

Thanks for the response, Cecil. The website you posted is actually the same one I'm referring to but I read a different article, which was on polygyny and adultery. In a church or formal atmosphere I can relate to what you're talking about, but in less formal areas like college parties, bars, flirtatious friends, things are often done all in the name of fun, but I do agree with you it can lead to more both in feeling and actual acts that would constitute as adultery or fornication.

I thought it might be the same overall site. I read the other articles, too. Pretty good.

College parties, bars, etc., I think the same thing applies. If what is rolling off of you in a spiritual sense is, "I'm a big caring teddy bear. I care about YOU, and am glad to see you.", that will be sensed. If what is rolling off of you is, "I need to get my ashes hauled and am looking to hook up -- all in good fun of course", that too will be sensed.

And the bottom line would seem to be that sharing a sexualized experience with someone inappropriate is still inappropriate, whether done in "good clean fun" or in lustful passion.

How would this work for an individual standard? If you'd feel right about doing it with contemporary and older folks at church, go for it. If not, best not? I can't imagine anyone suggesting its ok to engage in lots of stuff that happens "in the name of fun" at church with the elder's wife.

 

[CecilW]

The question and possibly the answer changes somewhat when discussing an appropriate boundary for a seriously courting couple, but that is a different topic.

 

[steve]

cec pretty much much spells it out. we typically want strict rules so that we can judge (mostly in other peoples lives) exactly where the line is and how close to it we are. but as cec says, it is a matter of the heart

as far as divorce goes;
Mat 19:8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.

it comes down to the hardness of heart. lets avoid the hardness
i divorced my first wife because of hardness in both of our hearts, but the hardness in mine was the final judge. had i known then what i know today there would have been no divorce

 

[PolyPride]

The question and possibly the answer changes somewhat when discussing an appropriate boundary for a seriously courting couple, but that is a different topic.

Lets talk about that. That is one reason why I started this topic to distinguish between what our modern-day culture considers adultery and cheating compared to what the Bible calls adultery. I basically want to know what can a married man engage in while courting a woman who's single. I gotta run some errands but I'll elaborate on my question more later on.

 

[Mark C]

I basically want to know what can a married man engage in while courting a woman who's single.

If the woman is TRULY "single", you cannot possibly commit "adultery".

It is more important, in that sense, to know that she is truly not married (either lawfully "divorced", or widowed, or never married -- obviously another discussion). And the other question becomes what do you need to AVOID doing, short of being willing to be joined to such a woman as her permanent covering. Whatever is done cannot be "undone".

You will have to look at the spectrum the Bible addresses, from "lust" and perhaps deciding to 'covet', to "consummation", and answer that question for yourself, with His guidance, since it is YHVH alone who will ultimately judge your heart.

Blessings,
Mark

 

[PolyPride]

I basically want to know what can a married man engage in while courting a woman who's single.

If the woman is TRULY "single", you cannot possibly commit "adultery".

It may not be adultery but perhaps it could be fornication if the two don't marry.

It is more important, in that sense, to know that she is truly not married (either lawfully "divorced", or widowed, or never married -- obviously another discussion). And the other question becomes what do you need to AVOID doing, short of being willing to be joined to such a woman as her permanent covering. Whatever is done cannot be "undone".

You will have to look at the spectrum the Bible addresses, from "lust" and perhaps deciding to 'covet', to "consummation", and answer that question for yourself, with His guidance, since it is YHVH alone who will ultimately judge your heart.

Blessings,
Mark

When it comes to coveting or lusting, the 2 terms alone do not answer the question directly, because there can be good lusting and coveting and bad lusting and coveting. To my understanding thus far, immoral coveting or lusting involves "sexual" desires (sex as in sexual intercourse ) since the terms are mentioned in an immoral sense in terms of adultery (unlawful sex or intercourse).

 

[Edward the Elder]

If the woman is TRULY "single", you cannot possibly commit "adultery". - Mark C

This is so very true.

The condition of "singleness" is considerably rarer than many people might think it is. The term "single mother" for example, is more often an oxymoron than an accurate description. A widow with children might be regarded as a "single" mother, but put more accurately she is a widow. A divorcee is someone who has divorced. An estranged spouse is someone who is separated from a spouse. Someone who is single is someone who has never married. One would do well to remember that Christ did state that it is possible to marry someone who is already married. When a man marries another man's wife it is called adultery. Rings and vows and writ of contract do not a marriage make. A wedding ceremony makes no one more married than a funeral ceremony makes one more dead. The example of marriage that Christ referred to was the one given "from the beginning". Christ called it "one flesh". There is also a difference between a marriage and a wedding ceremony and just because the condition of marriage is honourable in all does not necesarily mean that ALL MARRIAGE is honourable. Hope this helps.