What Is & Is Not Porn?

[forcedelune]

If you have not read it already, I would recommend you first check out my thread entitled "Sex" vs Romance & Spirit Led Intimacy...otherwise, you may not properly understand where I'm coming here.

http://www.biblicalfamilies.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=3796

This is an issue that the Holy Spirit has been working on in my heart and convicting me to discern over the years (when around books, magazines, movies, TV shows, billboards, museums, classrooms, and even in churches). First, let me ask that you pause and pray before reading what I'm about to share- that you'll receive everything the Lord would have for you. This will take some time to lay out properly, so please bear with me. Let's start with a question.

What is your view regarding the subject of pornographic art or pornography in general? By that I'm referring to everything from those more scanty Michelangelo paintings to modern Hintai Anime. By logical association, I would also be referring to everything from a simple immodest photograph to a complex stream of XXX video images that flow from your eyes to the movie screen of your mind.

More to the point, I would like to show how and why the entire spectrum of this type of art/imaging is pornographic in nature- therefore warned against by the Word of God. The Lord tells us to flee fornication {Greek- Porneia} (with our heart, mind, eyes, ears, and feet- if need be). [1 Corinthians 6:18] I'd like us to consider the following questions: what is pornography, why is it porn, and how can we recognize (as well as protect ourselves) from this when we come in contact with it?

I'll start this subject by laying out some underpinnings of what the concept of porn actually is in the real world. First, let me dissect the original (Scripture based) meaning of the word pornographic: Porno+graphic. "Porno" is derived from the Greek word porneia. Porn is the Greek word we find in the Scriptures (New Testament), which is translated as "fornication" or "harlotry" (depending on the context) in our English Bibles (KJV).

Porneia (fornication) is from the Greek root porne, which is where we originally derived our modern term porn. Used just in a figurative sense, this word means idolatry (spiritual fornication). Used literally, it refers to any expression of sexually related sin- which, by nature, is idolatry in that we worship the body more than the Creator when we disobey Him with it. Check out the context surrounding this word as it's used in Scripture:

[Matthew 5:32] "But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of porn, causes her to commit adultery..."

[Romans 1:29] "...being filled with all manner of unrighteousness, porn, wickedness..."

[1 Corinthians 5:1] "It is reported commonly that there is porn among you, and such porn as is not so much as named among the Gentiles..."

[1 Corinthians 6:13,18] "...the body is not for porn, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body...Flee porn. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that commits fornication (porn) sins against his own body."

[1 Corinthians 7:2] "Nevertheless, to avoid porn, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband."

[Galatians 5:19] "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, porn, uncleanness, lasciviousness..."

[Ephesians 5:3] "But porn, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you (in your heart or in your midst), as is becoming to saints"

[1 Thessalonians 4:3] "For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that you should abstain from porn."

So, going back to our original definition above, what is "sexual" anyway?

For the purposes of our focus in this writing, "sexual" is anything related to the body that God has set apart as private from the opposite sex (see Genesis 3; Leviticus 18-20; 2 Samuel 11:2). Keep in mind, that we are discussing God given (natural) sexuality...while the unnatural sensual expressions (such as men being with men, female prostitution, incest, pedophilia, and the like) are sexual sin by nature and so are pornographic at their very root. [Romans 1:26-27] Let's continue on with that in mind.

Now privacy applies, both, to specific areas of the body and to activities being done to/with the body (usually related to areas that are arousing in nature). This is only logical, when you think it through in light of Scripture. I'll only address what areas of the body are private at this point- we can build from there and uncover what are pornographic activities later (keeping any descriptions still "family friendly" of course).

Both aspects (private areas and private activities) have some clear-cut right/wrong and some discretion based territory (determined by your heart, circumstance, and spiritual discernment), so let's lay a solid foundation (based on God's Word) and let the Holy Spirit build the rest. There's no need to get too involved in specific standards of right or wrong beyond what is evident in God's Word and is plain to our natural reasoning. Again...as the Word says and as the Holy Spirit convicts..."Come let us reason together." [Isaiah 1:18] What say you?

 

[FollowingHim]

You have seriously misquoted these verses and misrepresented the meaning of the Greek by substituting "sexual immorality" with the term "porn". Furthermore, you misunderstand the Greek meaning of the word "pornography".

The word "pornography" is not derived from the word "porneia" (sexual immorality). Rather, both are derived from the Greek word "porn", which means prostitute.
- "porneia" essentially means to act like a prostitute (ie commit sexual immorality).
- "pornography" combines "porn" with the word "graphy", meaning writing or drawing, and literally means "to draw the prostitute".

When you quote

[Matthew 5:32] "But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of porn, causes her to commit adultery..."

you make it sound like pornography is grounds for divorce (as an English reader will read "porn" to mean "pornography"). But this is completely incorrect, the term pornography does not appear anywhere in scripture. The word is actually porneia. This verse actually says in a literal sense.

But I say unto you, that whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of acting like a prostitute, causes her to commit adultery.

Divorce is extremely serious, and "porneia" is a serious act. Do not trivialise the reasons for which someone may seek divorce by equating "porneia" with pornography - which, although also wrong, is something quite different.

Idolatry is equated with porneia, or "acting like a prostitute", because with both we are not being faithful - idolatry is unfaithfulness to our heavenly Husband, and a prostitute is doing the same thing in a physical sense.

Now, if we are to discuss pornography, let's not start by defining it entirely incorrectly and pretending the word "porneia" is an equivalent, because this false idea makes it sound like pornography is all through the New Testament. Please start with a correct understanding of the word, and build your case on that.

 

[CecilW]

On what feels to me like a practical note ...

Some things everyone would agree constitutes pornography, eg. an X rated movie.

When it gets to "grey" areas, I suggest that one man's normal is another man's sweaty palmed porn.

So best to not try to define it for our neighbor but look to our own issues.

If that means to avoid looking at the Sistene chapel ceiling in your case, then by all means avoid doing so.

Pretty simple ...

 

[Hugh McBryde]

A while ago I decided that it was when the subject of the photograph (in the case of visual porn), was looking directly AT you. That makes most advertising with a product spokeswoman into porn.....

 

[captainjonathan]

The Holy Spirit convicts us of sin. So, if I am living and walking with the Spirit and hiding God's word in my heart, God will guide me. This type of thread seems to me to be a how close can I get to the edge of the cliff scenario. Here is the paradox, when walking in faith there is no cliff. That is part of why circumcision/ uncircumcision does not matter. God's law says the physical act of adultery was sin, then clarified in the new covenant of grace that even looking at a married woman with lust is committing adultery. We have freedom now that we didn't have under the law, yet we are also more restrained. The law ruled actions, but when the Holy Spirit came and filled our hearts the law of the Spirit rules thoughts and motives.

 

[DiscussingTheTopic]

I wrote a lot so what I wrote might not be technically correct if I made errors or typos that I did not catch when writing this.

Consider the following. A medical doctor looks at lots of pictures in order to gain a knowledge about the human body. A police detective could watch the video of a sinful crime in order to catch the criminals, it would be a sin for the criminals to do a sinful crime, but not necessarily a sin for the police detective to watch the video of them doing the sinful crime in order to catch them. Note that I did not say all crimes are sins, nor did I say all sins are crimes.

1. It is the attitude that determines whether or not it is a sin to watch not the content. It is not a sin to look, but a sin to look with lust.

2. It is a sin for people to commit sin in order to make a video, picture, etc.
But making a video or picture and watching one are two separate things

It could be ok to watch a video for educational purposes provided you are not watching with the intent of looking with sinful lust at someone you are not married to, but that does not mean it is ok for people to do something unethical in order to make the video, like committing unethical behaviors in the acting process. But it could actually be ethical to watch a video that was unethically made, but it would still be unethical to make it in an unethical way such as doing unethical behaviors in the acting process. Unethical behaviors could be like if the actors were not married to each other and doing things that are unethical for unmarried people to do together. But I would guess most people watch those videos for the purpose of lusting sinfully after someone they are not married to which would be a sin. Unethical and criminal are not always the same thing, something could be unethical but still be legal under United States law.

3. It is not a sin for someone to look at their spouse. It would not be a sin for someone to look at the picture of their own spouse.

4. It is not always a sin to look at someone elses spouse although it is always a sin to look at someone else's spouse sinfully. And if I am wrong about that then it would traditionally be a sin to go to Church in the traditional manner unless all the married people were invisible, etc. How could you talk to a married pastor or pastor's wife face to face, if it is a sin to look at his or her face. But it would be a sin to look at his or her face sinfully.

5. Many of the romance stories that women like to read can be a sin for them personally to read even though they do not have images, because they read them with sinful lustful intent, although if they read them without sinful lustful intent it might not be a sin.

 

[GrooveyDude]

It usually involves sex videos, tapes, and photos regardless of whether it is consensual or not.