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A question about the requirements of Godly husbands

S

Soli Deo Gloria

New Member
Male
Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her

Husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself.

However, let each one of you love his wife as
himself

Husbands, love your wives, and do not be harsh with them

Husbands, live with your wives in an understanding way, showing honor to the woman as the weaker vessel, since they are heirs with you of the grace of life, so that your prayers may not be hindered.

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Here are some of the main commands men are given in the NT for how men should treat their wives. In my time on this forum and in other places I've seen a number of examples where men take their perceptions of patriarchy to a level that to me, frankly seems to nullify these requirements and make a caricature of what my belief in a patriarchal system to look like. Now I understand that there are always going to be those rotten apples on the fringe who spoil the whole the bunch. It seems like there are some who think that the man's way is the best way, the only way, and the wife/wives are practically to lie down and take whatever the man wants. I have read all of the OT passages, and they don't seem to enumerate how a man should treat his wife/wives in the way that the NT does, which means to me that the NT passages serve to raise the bar for how men are to treat those of their household. I'm not trying to make this sound like a rant, sorry if it comes off that way, I am just concerned that the way we approach our views on women can serve to only give fodder to those who oppose Polygyny, as their preconceptions of the demeaning of women by this lifestyle will only be confirmed when they see men talk like this. Can any of you, specifically those who have been in this a long time, speak to this issue?
 
Those verses don’t enumerate anything, they are some good principles but aren’t a yardstick by which to measure anyone.
Leadership is something that is required of the husband and few are skilled at it. His leadership must be the best way because it is his job to find the best way (that may or may not include consulting the rest of the family).
 
steve said:
Those verses don’t enumerate anything
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Self sacrifice
Equal treatment
Do not be harsh
Be understanding
Show honor

How are these not enumerations?

steve said:
Leadership is something that is required of the husband and few are skilled at it.
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Wholeheartedly agree.

steve said:
His leadership must be the best way because it is his job to find the best way
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A man's way is not the best way by virtue of him being the man, but rather by his leadership being the closest to leading God's way. The measuring stick of which you speak is just that, God's way, not the man's, unless they are aligned, is this not true?

I'm not trying to sound contrarian, these are honest questions.
 
Poly Deo Gloria said:
Can any of you, specifically those who have been in this a long time, speak to this issue?
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Sure.

First of all, to do polygamy you have to keep your first wife. So somehow you have to do right by her so she does not leave you. All the verses that you gave are example of how to do right by her. Men should be self-sacrificial, should love his wife as he loves himself, he should not be harsh, and he should honor her as the weaker vessel.

I think we are all in agreement on this.

Someone asked in another thread what made a perfect wife, and several men spoke up that their wives were an excellent example. These men were trying to honor their wives publically.

If you went to a retreat you would see that all of the men love and honor their wives.

Having said all of the above, let me point out some things. God loves and honors Jesus, but that did not keep him from sending Jesus to the cross, even though Jesus asked not to be sent. Love and honor is not the same as "being nice". Sometimes it means being asked to do difficult things.

Part of the love and honor that we give to our wives includes the responsibility to teach them God's truth as in Ephesians 5:26.

You may be confused by the amount of patriarchy discussion on here. It may seem like we focus on it too much, but in my opinion that is because our Western Civ culture gets it so wrong, and it is getting worse and our mission here is Biblical Families, not Polygamy Families.
 
Poly Deo Gloria said:
A man's way is not the best way by virtue of him being the man, but rather by his leadership being the closest to leading God's way. The measuring stick of which you speak is just that, God's way, not the man's, unless they are aligned, is this not true?
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A couple may have disagreements about what way is best, which way is more Godly, and where God is leading them. At some point someone has to put their foot down and say this is the way it is going to be. God solves this problem by saying in the Bible that that person is the man. Otherwise there would be division which God hates.
 
Part of the challenge, @Poly Deo Gloria , is that we are so steeped in an egalitarian postmodern feminism that even loving our women while expecting a proper level of Biblical submission is viewed as 'unloving.' The truth, Biblically, is that the most living thing we can do is embrace and walk in our respective roles. Each man will have to find that balance in his own family and God will bless it.

Avoiding that balance, or not pushing deeper into God's ways out of fear, discomfort, pushback, or any number of other 'excuses' is called rebellion on the part of the head. We each will be held accountable before God for ourselves and our wives and families. She will not be held accountable for your actions, but you will be for hers...
 
PeteR said:
Part of the challenge, @Poly Deo Gloria , is that we are so steeped in an egalitarian postmodern feminism that even loving our women while expecting a proper level of Biblical submission is viewed as 'unloving.' The truth, Biblically, is that the most living thing we can do is embrace and walk in our respective roles. Each man will have to find that balance in his own family and God will bless it.

Avoiding that balance, or not pushing deeper into God's ways out of fear, discomfort, pushback, or any number of other 'excuses' is called rebellion on the part of the head. We each will be held accountable before God for ourselves and our wives and families. She will not be held accountable for your actions, but you will be for hers...
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I don't think I disagree with any of this
 
Poly Deo Gloria said:
Self sacrifice
Equal treatment
Do not be harsh
Be understanding
Show honor

How are these not enumerations?
Click to expand...
They outline how to treat our wives - within the context of "wives obey your husbands" and "the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church".

There are two sides to this question. The challenge for us each, individually, is to live both of them. There are reasons that the husband is placed in charge of the family.

I believe the main reason the husband is placed in charge of the family is because, quite simply, a democracy of two would simply be an argument. Somebody has to be in charge, so God has picked somebody. That somebody is the husband. That means we have a clear structure, no argument about who is making the final decision when there is disagreement, and we can move forward to be productive. When a decision has to be made, a conclusion can be reached.

Because God has chosen the husband, He has also equipped him for this role. Mens and womens brains are different, and men have been designed more towards this role, while women have been designed more towards a nurturing / motherly role. Speaking in very general terms of course as everyone is different and there are always exceptions that prove the rule.

That does NOT mean the husband will always be right. He will, inevitably, make the wrong decision sometimes. There will inevitably be some time in his life (and probably more than one) where his wife will be able to say "told you so", where she was right and he was wrong, and made the wrong decision as a result of not listening to her advice. On the other hand, there will certainly be times when it is very important that the husband does NOT follow his wife's advice, but does what he knows is right even though she disagrees - scripture makes this clear. And there will be times when both are wrong.

But by delegating the man as the head, God has given us a clear framework for the family that we can move forwards within, avoiding arguments, and allowing us to focus on working together constructively. The challenge for us as men is to actually do a good job of that role. To learn from God how He would have us act.
 
FollowingHim said:
They outline how to treat our wives - within the context of "wives obey your husbands" and "the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church".

There are two sides to this question. The challenge for us each, individually, is to live both of them. There are reasons that the husband is placed in charge of the family.

I believe the main reason the husband is placed in charge of the family is because, quite simply, a democracy of two would simply be an argument. Somebody has to be in charge, so God has picked somebody. That somebody is the husband. That means we have a clear structure, no argument about who is making the final decision when there is disagreement, and we can move forward to be productive. When a decision has to be made, a conclusion can be reached.

Because God has chosen the husband, He has also equipped him for this role. Mens and womens brains are different, and men have been designed more towards this role, while women have been designed more towards a nurturing / motherly role. Speaking in very general terms of course as everyone is different and there are always exceptions that prove the rule.

That does NOT mean the husband will always be right. He will, inevitably, make the wrong decision sometimes. There will inevitably be some time in his life (and probably more than one) where his wife will be able to say "told you so", where she was right and he was wrong, and made the wrong decision as a result of not listening to her advice. On the other hand, there will certainly be times when it is very important that the husband does NOT follow his wife's advice, but does what he knows is right even though she disagrees - scripture makes this clear. And there will be times when both are wrong.

But by delegating the man as the head, God has given us a clear framework for the family that we can move forwards within, avoiding arguments, and allowing us to focus on working together constructively. The challenge for us as men is to actually do a good job of that role. To learn from God how He would have us act.
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Agreed 100%.

If this revelation has been anything to me, it has been a wake-up call to the reality of just how high the calling a husband, regardless of how many wives he has, is. It has served to reinforce the areas that I've been growing, and also challenge me in new areas, and it has strengthened and encouraged my wife and I in a lot of ways.
 
With most decisions, the most important thing is not whether the decision is right or wrong. Rather, what matters is that (1) a decision is actually reached, and (2) everybody involved accepts that decision.

For instance, you're trying to decide whether to buy a new car or a second-hand car. Both are very different - one is very expensive and will involve sacrifices elsewhere, one is cheap but could fail. But you will survive with either decision. Neither is "right" or "wrong", they're just different.

Let's say the wife wants a new car, and the husband wants a cheap car. They could argue back and forth forever. They could buy either person's preference, and the other may resent it for years. The husband could resent the cost of the new car and the extra work it takes to pay for it - or the wife, when the cheap car breaks down in 6 months, could throw it back in the husband's face with "I told you so". Either way is bitter.

But with the husband as the head, a decision can be reached. He may decide that his preference is best, and do that, or he may decide to do his wife's preference out of love for her. But either way, a decision is made. And his wife chooses to submit to that decision, whether she likes it or not - her input has been considered, and the time for argument is over. They can now move forward as a team. She can support him with paying for the new car, or she can politely keep her mouth shut when the cheap car breaks down and simply help him get it fixed. But either way, they're a team.

That's the primary purpose of patriarchy, in my view. Achieving unity and peace.
 
FollowingHim said:
...he may decide to do his wife's preference out of love for her.
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I agree with all you have said but I'm wondering if your choice of words here might be misunderstood(?) The husband's choice either way ought to be made with a love for his wife; new car or second hand car, love will be a motivating factor for him and she must recognise that. Shalom
 
Good clarification. A new car is not the best example of what I was meaning there, as it's a serious matter you wouldn't make a decision you disagreed with just out of emotion.

A better example is a smaller one: He wants to go to an Indian restaurant and she wants Chinese. He decides to go to the Chinese restaurant, not because he thinks it's the best decision, or because he's obeying his wife, but because he wants to be generous to his wife because he loves her. Of course, he might also decide to go to the Indian restaurant, and that would not at all be unloving, he might have very loving reasons to do so - nevertheless love is a major motivating factor in his choosing to bless his wife by giving her her preference in a decision.
 
Just to add to my earlier comment
frederick said:
The husband's choice either way ought to be made with a love for his wife; new car or second hand car, love will be a motivating factor for him and she must recognise that.
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Because God loves us perfectly He doesn't necessarily give us what we want but what is good and will be best for us. A husband will be trying to imitate such divine character in his marriages.
 
Equal doesn’t work, they are different and have different needs. It would be an impossible balancing act.
I think that you mean that they should be treated fairly.
Relatively fairly.
 
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