Dowry

[Evo]

We can see in the Bible they used to give dowry for the girl under her father's roof (virgin may be) to the father.
It seems in western culture there's no dowry, but here in Africa it is a must.

The way dowry is given depends on the culture, on the tribe, on the family...
In some tribes the dowry of the 1st and 2nd daughter won't be given to the father, but to an uncle who was designated to take.
If it's not respected you get spiritual attack.
Either the married girl will have conception issues, or might die....

My father was a Christian and refused to follow the culture. He had many daughter for those married he took their dowries.

Unfortunately he passed away in 2016.

My question is: who should take the dowry as the fathee has passed away?
The mother, the 1st son or should it be given to God? (As an orphan God is my father)

Why am I asking this: in the family, we said the 1st son would take it as dad is no more.
I called the 1st to tell him about the marriage plan and it's supposesed to happen in June.
So he's got to tell already what should be given, so that the man prepares himself.
Until now we have not got any feedback. (He said he would call at the end of May but didn't )

There's one thing that happened. My elder sisters,from another mother same father.
It seems that they hate us (my mom's children )
They are not happy with that marriage
They don't want this to happen.
They are influencing the 1st son, their brother same mom same dad to refuse.
May be that's why he's taking time to give a feedback.

Few weeks ago I had some weird dream about one of my half sister and how she's fighting the marriage.she's in witchcraft.
It happened twice.
I started praying (last year she cursed, said horrible things about me to one of my half sisters)

My mother suggested to take the dowry and give it to God as the elders from a different mother without a reasons wanna complicate things.
Doing so will create more spiritual attacks as they are in whichcraft and won't be happy that we changed our mind and decided not to give to them anymore.

Who has got power over children when the father has passed away: God directly, mother or the 1st male (1st son)?


Your feedback will be soooo appreciated.
And please keep me in your prayers.

 

[FollowingHim]

Your father was responsible for your welfare (food, clothing, health), and in return received all work you could do for him, and would in future have a right to receive your dowry. The dowry is a payment that recognises that your father will no longer have you working for him, as you are going to your husband, so it compensates him for the loss of your work.

So your father had a major responsibility (providing for you), and in return received an asset - firstly receiving the work you did to help him, later receiving your dowry to replace this work, when you stop serving him and start serving your husband. The dowry is a financial asset that will mature some time in the future - it's a "futures contract" in financial terms.

The question is, who inherited this responsibility, and the corresponding assets?

When your father died:
1) Who took over the responsibility of providing for you?
2) Who in the family did you serve the most (or should have served the most if you did not!), in the way you had served your father?
3) Who in the family (if anybody) will receive less help from you as a result of your marriage, with you being busy serving your new husband?
4) Who inherited your father's financial assets (house, money etc)? Did they mostly go to your eldest brother, your mother (and any other wives), were they shared among the children, or did they go to another person (tribal chief, other relative)?
5) Who (if anybody) inherited your father's social duties and place in society (his job, role in the church, role in the tribe or local community etc).

I think the answers to these questions will help you and us to understand who, if anybody, has taken over your father's responsibilities and inherited his financial assets - including the right to receive your dowry. If they do not give a clear answer, then answering them may at least help us to understand your situation better.

The Bible does not give a clear, simple answer to your question. This means we need to try and understand the general principles of how God looks at things, try to look at them from His perspective, and use wisdom to work out the answer. I cannot apply wisdom to this question without first understanding your culture and family situation a little better.

 

[rockfox]

A related question, in your culture, what ultimately becomes of the dowry? Is it forever the uncle/father's? Or do they hold it in trust for someone else?

In some cultures dowry is as Samuel says but in others it was seen as surety of the marriage (to be returned to the husband or the wife on marital breakup) or passed on as inheritance for the children of the marriage.

 

[Evo]

Your father was responsible for your welfare (food, clothing, health), and in return received all work you could do for him, and would in future have a right to receive your dowry. The dowry is a payment that recognises that your father will no longer have you working for him, as you are going to your husband, so it compensates him for the loss of your work.

So your father had a major responsibility (providing for you), and in return received an asset - firstly receiving the work you did to help him, later receiving your dowry to replace this work, when you stop serving him and start serving your husband. The dowry is a financial asset that will mature some time in the future - it's a "futures contract" in financial terms.

The question is, who inherited this responsibility, and the corresponding assets?

When your father died:
1) Who took over the responsibility of providing for you?
2) Who in the family did you serve the most (or should have served the most if you did not!), in the way you had served your father?
3) Who in the family (if anybody) will receive less help from you as a result of your marriage, with you being busy serving your new husband?
4) Who inherited your father's financial assets (house, money etc)? Did they mostly go to your eldest brother, your mother (and any other wives), were they shared among the children, or did they go to another person (tribal chief, other relative)?
5) Who (if anybody) inherited your father's social duties and place in society (his job, role in the church, role in the tribe or local community etc).

I think the answers to these questions will help you and us to understand who, if anybody, has taken over your father's responsibilities and inherited his financial assets - including the right to receive your dowry. If they do not give a clear answer, then answering them may at least help us to understand your situation better.

The Bible does not give a clear, simple answer to your question. This means we need to try and understand the general principles of how God looks at things, try to look at them from His perspective, and use wisdom to work out the answer. I cannot apply wisdom to this question without first understanding your culture and family situation a little better.

1. I providefor myself
2. My mother
3. No one
4. They mostly went to my mother
5. No one

 

[Evo]

A related question, in your culture, what ultimately becomes of the dowry? Is it forever the uncle/father's? Or do they hold it in trust for someone else?

In some cultures dowry is as Samuel says but in others it was seen as surety of the marriage (to be returned to the husband or the wife on marital breakup) or passed on as inheritance for the children of the marriage.

Those who take the dowry do what they want with it may be pay school's fee for the kids, groceries,....
It depends they are free to do what they what with the money

But it's not always money
They also ask for oil, cookwares, FM radio, TV, clothes for both parents, salt, goat, cow, .....
It depends on family

In my family my father would just ask for money and parents' clothes

 

[FollowingHim]

1. I providefor myself
2. My mother
3. No one
4. They mostly went to my mother
5. No one

So your father did not give his financial assets to his eldest son. Rather, he gave them to your mother. I assume he either wrote a will that gave his assets to her, or you all knew this is what he wanted from talking to him through his life.

If you had married before your father died, he would have taken the dowry, and then your mother would have inherited it and would have it after his death. It would have helped to provide for her in her widowhood. That appears to be what your father would have wanted to do with the dowry. He would have wanted it to go to your mother. You can see that in the fact that he "refused to follow the culture" as you have said, and gave most of his assets to your mother on his death - which would have included your dowry if he had received it already.

Your father does not appear to have consciously handed his family to your eldest brother. He either handed it to nobody, or to your mother. So in my personal opinion, you are either under nobody's authority, or your mother's authority. I must stress that this is my personal opinion, I cannot find a clear answer in scripture. But in my opinion, in the situation you have described, I see no reason for you to need the approval of your eldest brother in order to marry, particularly if you do have the approval of your mother.

If your dowry belongs to your mother, then she can choose to give it to God (as she has suggested), keep it (it will help to provide for her), or hand it back to you if she prefers not to receive it. A widow is not under the authority of a man, but is her own authority and can make such decisions for herself (Numbers 30:9).

Finally, we are told over and over again in scripture to support widows (e.g. Deuteronomy 24:19), and especially our own mothers (1 Timothy 5:3-4). This is a common theme throughout scripture. This dowry is a way you can honour your father and mother (Exodus 20:12) by continuing to provide for your mother after your father's death.

I am not familiar with your culture. These suggestions may be completely out of line with the culture, and feel free to reject them on that basis. I am just trying to understand it logically and apply the principles of scripture to it, to try and understand how God would see the situation.

Obviously, your brother would not like this decision. I understand your concerns about witchcraft being used against you if you did not give the dowry to him. This is an understandable concern - but our God is stronger than any devil, and you do not need to be afraid of witchcraft when He is on your side.