I don't mind strong opinions, but personal attacks, of any sort, I find to be very bad. I love the give and take of a spirited debate, but people who take offense, and use that as an excuse to attack personally, I don't like. Jesus debated all the time, but showed a lot a restraint and tolerance to many of His attackers. It is especially bad for Christians to be mean spirited. The Bible says, unless ye be AS a little child you will never see the Kingdom of Heaven. It doesn't say to BE a little child, but to be AS a little child. That is my model.
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Glad I found this site
- Thread starter Founder
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Welcome, Founder. Glad to have you here.
Paul
Paul
Thanks all... I am very pro-life, so much so, that I believe that any attempts to avoid reproduction amount to murder of ones own children. This is my number one issue. But I have others. I believe I care about all good outcomes of every sort and consider the Bible to be inerrant. But, everything in the Bible depends on proper understanding and interpretation, and that is very, very hard to find. I'm new and don't understand this software, but I'm working on it.
Founder,
Be sure to check out our resources page for more information on particulars related to plural marriage. There is nothing in contradiction with your views on reproduction and God's plan for families (I know I am preaching to the choir....)
http://www.biblicalfamilies.org/resources.php
But, you may find some additional material of merit as you begin your journey.
Blessings,
Doc
Be sure to check out our resources page for more information on particulars related to plural marriage. There is nothing in contradiction with your views on reproduction and God's plan for families (I know I am preaching to the choir....)
http://www.biblicalfamilies.org/resources.php
But, you may find some additional material of merit as you begin your journey.
Blessings,
Doc
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi Founder,
I believe that I share your views on these pro life issues. I have been searching and researching a while on these topics. One document I love is the pope's Encyclical "Humanae Vitae" although it espouses NFP of which I am a fan only in the sense that it helps women and girls learn more about how their bodies work and take care of their health. I recently read a book I borrowed called "Birth Control and the Bible" now I can't remember the title. it is a short booklet but amazing and has lots of quotes by John Calvin and others that show what the reformers and even early churhc fathers thought about this issue. This topic is fascinating historically and spiritually as well. I think birth control is more socially ingrained than monogamy! I will find that book on amazon or somethign and get u a link, ok?
I believe that I share your views on these pro life issues. I have been searching and researching a while on these topics. One document I love is the pope's Encyclical "Humanae Vitae" although it espouses NFP of which I am a fan only in the sense that it helps women and girls learn more about how their bodies work and take care of their health. I recently read a book I borrowed called "Birth Control and the Bible" now I can't remember the title. it is a short booklet but amazing and has lots of quotes by John Calvin and others that show what the reformers and even early churhc fathers thought about this issue. This topic is fascinating historically and spiritually as well. I think birth control is more socially ingrained than monogamy! I will find that book on amazon or somethign and get u a link, ok?
Itsoktobesingle <img src=\"{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_wink.gif\" alt=\";)\" title=\"Wink\" /> said:
Great to hear your quite informed views on the most important subject of all to me. We can have all the wives in the world in loving relationships, but if they are not not having the children that God wants, and that we need, then all is in vain. I'm worried that my views that drill down to this sort of bedrock will not be received with the love and good will that I intend them. I would love to get a reference to this book you remember. Heritage and FRC has jointly put out a Video called Demographic Winter. It is a dynamite teaching tool on this subject. Let me know in what way I can be of help to you. I have written extensively this subject, even more than I have researched and written on PM. I, like God, want to see the fruit of what any of us do, or don't do, and evaluate that fruit as to its quality, otherwise we become buried in a swamp of sterile and fruitless legalisms.
Founder said:
Hello Founder,
There are others here that are just as pro-life to the extent of anti-birth control as you are... I would fall into that category. However, I would like to mention that we should be cautious in regards to making marriage all about reproduction. Certainly, that is one of the main reasons for getting married. Yet, there are those who cannot have children, or pass the children bearing age, and I would hope that we as believers do not come accross as if to communicate that this makes marriage to these women wrong or less than perfect, if you know what I mean?
On the other hand, I think that we believers of the last 100 years have bought into the idea that children are NOT a gift from God, but a curse. So, we embrace the humanist views that having a few kids (or none at all) is perfectly ok. I have a great deal to say about this, but it could get too offensive for this forum. So, if you ever want to discuss this, please pm me.
Greetings Pastor Randy
Yes, I totally agree with you in your caveats. Marriage is surely more than just about children, think about Abraham who was married to Sarah for a great number of years BEFORE she ever bore a child, and during that time she was substantially instrumental in his incredible service to God and the Kingdom. So Wives and husband perform majestic and important roles other than bearing children.
However, that being said, we are faced with a "Birth Dearth" that is little less than a genocidal holocaust of our own making led, of course the Devil. WE almost literally have no children any more. Believers are reproducing at half of replacement, which means that any such group that reproduces at those rates becomes statistically extinct in less than a century. Surely this cannot be the will of God that we disappear from the earth.
Now, we may lose this fight, as we may lose the fight against the anti-Christ generally, BUT our job is to resist with all our strength, whether we win or lose. That is the clear message of the Bible. This is a bone fide emergency, and way above someones, anyones, feelings. I do care about everyones feelings, but some things are so important, as to be, as Cromwell said, "beyond good manners."
I love good manners, and try to always have them, but they have been known to work against us as well as for us. Even Jesus got mad with righteous anger over some things.
Is any organization in this country actually doing anything about this problem? If not, someone should start something that would have as it prime priority this pending extinction of this country, AND its Christian Churches.
Yes, I totally agree with you in your caveats. Marriage is surely more than just about children, think about Abraham who was married to Sarah for a great number of years BEFORE she ever bore a child, and during that time she was substantially instrumental in his incredible service to God and the Kingdom. So Wives and husband perform majestic and important roles other than bearing children.
However, that being said, we are faced with a "Birth Dearth" that is little less than a genocidal holocaust of our own making led, of course the Devil. WE almost literally have no children any more. Believers are reproducing at half of replacement, which means that any such group that reproduces at those rates becomes statistically extinct in less than a century. Surely this cannot be the will of God that we disappear from the earth.
Now, we may lose this fight, as we may lose the fight against the anti-Christ generally, BUT our job is to resist with all our strength, whether we win or lose. That is the clear message of the Bible. This is a bone fide emergency, and way above someones, anyones, feelings. I do care about everyones feelings, but some things are so important, as to be, as Cromwell said, "beyond good manners."
I love good manners, and try to always have them, but they have been known to work against us as well as for us. Even Jesus got mad with righteous anger over some things.
Is any organization in this country actually doing anything about this problem? If not, someone should start something that would have as it prime priority this pending extinction of this country, AND its Christian Churches.