• Biblical Families is not a dating website. It is a forum to discuss issues relating to marriage and the Bible, and to offer guidance and support, not to find a wife. Click here for more information.

Head or Block-head???

CecilW

Member
Real Person
Male
... But I'm the HEAD of this family! See? It says so right HERE!
*Finger pounding on a Bible open to 1Cor11:3*
:x
And you're my BODY! So you got to OBEY me in this!

If you are a man, do you find yourself blushing at the realization that you, well, sometimes resemble that scenario? :oops:
Wives, do you, sadly, recognize your husband? :evil:

Is such a man functioning as the head or the block-head of his family?

I just listened to a wonderful sermon by a very, very wise and effective pastor, Glen Coon. At the time of the sermon (and he lived for some time afterward,) he'd been happily married for 56 or so years. Was he hen-pecked? No way! A strong leader. Happy marriage. Effective marriage counselor (tho that wasn't his primary focus).

But he rather shocked me when he said, "If you are running around telling your wife what to do on the basis of being the head of the family, you aren't a head, you're a block-head! No man has the right to tell his wife what to do."

Now, as y'all might imagine, that opened my eyes rather wide! :o :shock: After all, I believe in Patriarchy, etc. But because of my astronomical level of respect for this man, bolstered by his 56 years of happy marriage, I listened on. Glad I did.

Turned out that what he was referring to was high-handed, dictatorial, controlling, dominating behavior. And with that understanding, I had to agree.

How do effective managers manage? After discussion when needed, they set the goal to be attained, then get out of the way and let their staff have at it.

Getting Biblical, the Proverbs 31 woman sure doesn't seem to have a controlling, dominating husband. He's off at the city gates discussing, a-HEM, weighty matters with the other wise men over cups of espresso. ;)

Maybe, just maybe, turning his wife loose to do her thing without being controlling is the very proof of his wisdom? :roll: Hmmm... anyway ...

The thing that got me, however, in Pastor Coon's statement, was the bit about no man having a RIGHT to tell his wife what to do. I mean, sure! High handed use of authority is never wise in a relationship. I try pretty hard to avoid it myself. (You'll have to ask someone else about my success or failure.) But no right?

Did he mean no right to put one's foot down and say, "These are the rules / standards of this family? This is the direction I am taking us? This is what we need to do within that time frame?" I don't think so. He was too clearly a wise but definite leader in his own church and home. Rather, I think that he had grasped the exception left unlisted in the purpose for man's creation.

Hunh? Oh, it's right there. Genesis 1:26. We like to get all warm and fuzzy and say stuff like, "God created us for companionship and relatinship with Himself." Aaawwwww! May even be true! But what He/They (Elohim being a plural word) SAID was, "Let Us make man(kind) in Our image, after Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every living thing that creeps on the earth."

So God made us humans for the purpose of us exercising DOMINION. We're supposed to dominate nature in a benevolent manner. In fact, that spectrum given pretty well covers what was created during creation week, right? :roll: ... with one notable exception.

It neither instructed nor allowed for humans taking dominion over each other! :o There ya go. There's the exception. So in Gen 3:16, when God warns Adam that one of the effects of sin was that the woman would crave to dominate him (the Hebrew helps. Same language as Gen 4:7), He was warning against this God-given urge, perhaps even compulsion, to exercise Godly dominion being twisted into a demonic urge to dominate. Huh.

Listened to another, current pastor today, Curry Blake, who addressed the same topic after a fashion. He offered the observation that all wars, and divorces (Now, just WHAT is the difference? :lol: ) have at their core someone who is trying to exercise dominion over other humans, instead of over the things that we should -- the critters, the weather, and demons / illness.

He pointed out that Jesus specifically addressed this with the disciples, saying (slightly paraphrased), "It shall not be among you as among the heathens. For they struggle for position to Lord it over each other. But you! If you wanna be great," (note that He does NOT say, "Shame on you!" Rather, He proceeds to tell them HOW to achieve greatness!) "you achieve it by being the servant of all. Lay down your life for your family. Servanthood is the path to greatness!"

So I guess old Pastor Coon was right after all. Wanna be the head? Practice servanthood leadership. Wanna be the block-head? Throw your positional weight around and see where it gets ya?

Ok ... I'm off to chip away at my sharp corners and edges ... :ugeek:
 
I think there are very clear instructions in scripture that the husband IS to exercise "dominion" over his wife. Genesis 3:16, which you have referred to, states "Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you". Furthermore there are very clear commands that wives are to obey their husbands (Ephesians 5:22-24; Colossians 3:18; 1 Peter 3:1-6), and you can't obey if you aren't given any instructions. Finally, one of the Hebrew words that is used repeatedly to refer to husbands in the old testament is "ba'al", which means Master. The arrangement is stated repeatedly throughout the Bible and is very clear:
But I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God. (1 Corinthians 11:3)
The problem comes when men don't realise what all that actually means.

Patriarchal leadership does not start with a husband commanding his wife to obey him. It starts with LOVE. Just as our entire Christian faith starts with love.

Why do we obey Christ? Because He loves us so deeply that He was willing to die for us. We freely choose to follow and obey Him out of appreciation for the wonderful sacrifice that He made for us.

In the same way, a man is to love his wife first and foremost, just as Christ loves the church, so much that he is willing to die for her (Ephesians 5:25). He must put her first in everything, and this may cost him a lot. He is to be the servant-leader, just as Christ is. In response to this love, she is to freely choose to obey him. And she can't obey him if he never issues any instructions.

There are consequences to disobedience. Life doesn't go so well if we disobey Christ, and marriage doesn't go so well if a wife disobeys her husband. God's intent for our lives is for us all to obey Christ, and for wives to obey their husbands. This is the order He has established, and it works. However obedience and disobedience are still free choices. Adam chose to disobey God and eat the fruit, and a wife may choose to disobey her husband also. That doesn't mean it is ok for her to do so, quite the opposite, she is wrong to disobey. But she can still choose to do wrong, just as her husband can choose to sin also.

Get the foundation right - love - and a husband CAN tell his wife what to do. And she will willingly choose to obey.

Get the foundation wrong - tyrannical rule - and a husband will simply destroy his marriage and damage the woman that God entrusted to him, whom he was supposed to love, care for and protect.
 
Amen Samuel! I didn't have time to respond earlier, but you shared much of what was on my heart. The motivation of the husband should be Christlike, however even if the husband is not doing his job, the wife is not to disobey. Conversely, just because a wife does not submit does not mean a man has any business to love her any less nor sacrifice for her. It is designed to be symbiotic, but we both have our parts in marriage to mirror the relationship between Christ and the church.

Christ will never fail on His part, and so we do have a perfect example, one that in the flesh is impossible to fulfill. Thus, we walk by the spirit and we will not see the conflict, the contentious woman spoken of in Proverbs, etc. We are called to obey our own part, a great responsibility and privilege for both roles, roles which glorify Christ if we take them seriously and look to His glory rather than our own power or glory.
 
I agree with the love and servant leadership as we see exemplified in passages from Matthew, John, Luke and others; but question the use of the word dominion. Dominion according to the Oxford Dictionary is sovereignty,control. It is also another form of the word domination. I question whether or not that is the correct term to apply to a human relationship. If we mean in the sense of controlling what the person does or thinks then I think not, if only in the sense of influencing someone then perhaps.

My thoughts around these verses are:
Genesis 3:16 - This is not a command or law but rather a statement of how our relationship dynamics work. It's not a command to the husband to rule over her.
Ephesians 5:22-24 : A common mistake among Christians is to leave off verse 21. 21 explicitly states that we are to submit to one another out of reverence for the Lord. From my perspective, 22-24 then explain what this mutual submission looks like between a man and woman. Additionally, if we look at the word submit definition, we see that it means : accept or yield to a superior force or to the authority or will of another person. It's not about domination. Submitting to one another then would mean that the husband and wife submit to each other's will... however, that seems somewhat confusing, for how then would we arrive at decisions in situations in which we disagree. That's where 22-24 come into play.
Colossians 3:18 : The above Ephesians passage comments would come into play.
1 Peter 3:1-6 : Would also need to read chapter 2 because 3 is just a continuation of chapter 2, additionally, would need chapt 3 verses 7-9 as well, which basically states your prayers will be hindered if you don't love/treat her properly. Interesting to me is that we don't see the woman's prayer's being hindered by lack of submission...
Finally, the word submit (to my limited recollection) is not used from the perspective of a man telling a woman that she must submit... rather submit from it's very definition is I choose to accept your will / your desires over mine. It's not forced. God never forces me to submit to Him. I choose to submit to Him.
 
eternitee said:
A man exercising proper headship will rarely have to force his wife to do anything
Agreed. I have never forced my wife on a single issue. Does that mean I am doing it right? :lol:
 
Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever really forced anything... oh there was that time when we were getting out of debt and I cancelled cable without first discussing, and also said we're going to do a budget no matter what... the former went over quite poorly while the latter went over reasonably well. hmmm, me thinks there is a lesson in there somewhere. ;)
 
I have lived without cable tv for most of the last five years. I get so much accomplished without that constant distraction.

SweetLissa
 
sweetlissa said:
I have lived without cable tv for most of the last five years. I get so much accomplished without that constant distraction.

How do you LIVE without NCIS reruns? :roll:
 
Lol, I can't convince my wife to get rid of it... That said I do enjoy some of the cooking shows periodically, and the Science Channel. Like nerdy shows, like Through the Wormhole (science stuff), How it's Made , etc... but don't end up watching much, too busy reading, writing music and other things. :)
 
I do have internet so I can choose to watch a program once in a while but I do not get a constant dose of tv. I have to select what I watch. I watch very little, usually a few times a month.

SweetLissa
 
So my question is this, if we cannot imagine life without NCIS reruns, and we cannot convince another family member to live without cable TV, just exactly who is our God? Is it the NCIS reruns or the cable TV? If we are spending hours each week watching television, who are we serving?

Just asking...

No, I do not believe that television is a sin, but it does seem to be what much of our country idolizes and worships. Even many Christians.

SweetLissa
 
I rarely to never watch TV (the same cannot be said of my beloved computer/internet connection!) When I do watch TV I am always frustrated by the number of commercials. I then start clicking through the channels to find SOMETHING to watch and just find more channels with more commercials on. I don't have time for that nonsense and end up turning it off. If I am going to watch anything at all, I would rather stick a movie in so I am not subjected to the constant interruptions.
 
We have no TV, to be honest Chris I actually took a very soft approach over this issue with my wife and allowed her a few years of knowing exactly what I felt to slowly wean herself off it and find the benefits of having no TV for herself. It's good to bring her along with you.

We got rid of the TV and got broadband internet, replacing time spent watching trashy programmes with internet discussions, eventually Biblical Families... and now we know you all! Glad we ditched it. :D
 
To be fair, I find that she now tends to watch more educational type things than she did when we were first married. Funny, we both came from very different backgrounds, I had no tv growing up and tv was on all the time in their home. We dvr things to avoid commercials. :) I can almost get everything I want over the internet so that day may be coming. Very much enjoy my internet connection!
But somehow, I think I've taken a tangent and need to return to the main topic... which was... ? ;)
 
Back
Top