A House Full of Females

[southernphotini]

Has anyone read Ulrich's book on the role of women in Mormon culture and faith?

I think I have read it twice, and for me the fascinating bites were:

Polygamy was a response to the large number of widows and divorced women in the community. Which wasn't surprising.

Polygamy actually tended to increase the power and status of women rather than diminish it, which is why Utah is the first state to give women the right to vote. It actually got to the point that Brigham Young saw all these outspoken, industrious women as a problem. This surprised me a lot.

The best part of the book for me was that it was largely told through the words of the women who lived it.

 

[LDremoved]

I haven't but I would love to, i'll have to see if I can find it on audio.

 

[rockfox]

Polygamy was a response to the large number of widows and divorced women in the community. Which wasn't surprising.

That seems to be historically the case in many cultures.

It actually got to the point that Brigham Young saw all these outspoken, industrious women as a problem. This surprised me a lot.

Idle hands are the devils workshop as they say.

 

[southernphotini]

Idle hands are the devils workshop as they say.

Not idle. Incredibly industrious. Based on this account I doubt the LDS church would still exist without such active female participation in the faith.

 

[NickF]

Has anyone read Ulrich's book on the role of women in Mormon culture and faith?

I think I have read it twice, and for me the fascinating bites were:

Polygamy was a response to the large number of widows and divorced women in the community. Which wasn't surprising.

Polygamy actually tended to increase the power and status of women rather than diminish it, which is why Utah is the first state to give women the right to vote. It actually got to the point that Brigham Young saw all these outspoken, industrious women as a problem. This surprised me a lot.

The best part of the book for me was that it was largely told through the words of the women who lived it.

Listened to it on audio last year while on a consulting tour, fascinating stuff.

 

[NBTX11]

What are the main differences, if any, between Mormon PM and biblically based polygyny. I am not that up to speed on the mormon faith other than some basics.

 

[frederick]

What are the main differences, if any, between Mormon PM and biblically based polygyny. I am not that up to speed on the mormon faith other than some basics.

Having more than one woman/wife; whether a Mormon, Muslim, Christian, or Zulu King, it's all the same. A man has more than one woman/wife, so it's plural marriage. The beliefs a person holds doesn't change the fact.

 

[rockfox]

What are the main differences, if any, between Mormon PM and biblically based polygyny. I am not that up to speed on the mormon faith other than some basics.

Polygamy is only currently practiced in the independent Mormon sects. At least some of those have a fairly authoritarian leadership structure where it is reputed that the leadership will assign / reassign wives to men; essentially violating the authority of the father and husband in the matter.

 

[southernphotini]

Polygamy is only currently practiced in the independent Mormon sects. At least some of those have a fairly authoritarian leadership structure where it is reputed that the leadership will assign / reassign wives to men; essentially violating the authority of the father and husband in the matter.

That stems directly from Joseph Smith assigning widows to men for their care, and later as wives.

 

[steve]

Having more than one woman/wife; whether a Mormon, Muslim, Christian, or Zulu King, it's all the same. A man has more than one woman/wife, so it's plural marriage. The beliefs a person holds doesn't change the fact.

I beg to differ.
The enemy of our souls does not fear or hate polygyny in any religion other than Christianity.

 

[blessedwith2]

Not idle. Incredibly industrious. Based on this account I doubt the LDS church would still exist without such active female participation in the faith.

That could probably be said of a lot if not all churches. At least that is what I've seen.

 

[frederick]

I beg to differ.
The enemy of our souls does not fear or hate polygyny in any religion other than Christianity.

I agree but it is all polygyny.

 

[MeganC]

What are the main differences, if any, between Mormon PM and biblically based polygyny. I am not that up to speed on the mormon faith other than some basics.

First off when you say "Mormon PM" keep in mind there are several poly groups within the mainstream LDS and then several more within the schismatics such as the FLDS, RFLDS, and etc.

The mainstream LDS who quietly follow poly are very similar to us. No one is being forced into it, there is no pervert calling himself a prophet as an excuse to molest little girls, and people are free to leave.

That last bit is most important: Are you free to leave?

If the answer is no then it's a cult. All sorts of wrong can happen once a group heads into cult territory.

Old advice I was once given: If you have to ask if you're in a cult then you are.

Also: The difference between a religion and a cult is how they treat you if you want to leave.

Therefore the mainstream LDS is not a cult. So far I have not seen any poly groups within the mainstream LDS as cultish. Our LDS neighbors who follow the principle are pretty nice people.

The FLDS is a cult. The RFLDS is a bit less of a cult but still a cult.

 

[steve]

I agree but it is all polygyny.

If you think that polygyny contested by the enemy is the same as polygyny that is accepted by him…..ok.

 

[NBTX11]

Therefore the mainstream LDS is not a cult.

I am not an LDS expert, but based upon my limited knowledge and the fact that they have extra biblical authoritative scriptures, and do not hold to essential Christian doctrines, they could be considered a cult. Not based upon their marriage teachings, but based upon their teachings that don't align with the Christian Bible.

Again my knowledge is limited, but I have read enough to know they hold doctrines that Christians do not hold.

 

[FollowingHim]

What are the main differences, if any, between Mormon PM and biblically based polygyny. I am not that up to speed on the mormon faith other than some basics.

The mormon view of marriage itself differs, as they have the concept of "celestial marriage", where marriage is necessarily eternal, which is quite different to the Christian understanding where marriage ends at death. This has deep theological implications.

 

[MeganC]

I am not an LDS expert, but based upon my limited knowledge and the fact that they have extra biblical authoritative scriptures, and do not hold to essential Christian doctrines, they could be considered a cult. Not based upon their marriage teachings, but based upon their teachings that don't align with the Christian Bible.

Again my knowledge is limited, but I have read enough to know they hold doctrines that Christians do not hold.

Simply holding to beliefs that Christians do not hold does not make a cult.

The definition of the word speaks to this:

A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader.

In general, if you are free to leave when you want then it's not a cult.

And extremist beliefs abound even when the cult members don't think they follow a religion. Covid vaccine true believers come to mind here. So do the global warming cultists.