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A Plurality of Elders to Aid a Troubled Marriage?

Dr. K.R. Allen

Member
Real Person
About 16 to 17 biblical texts speak to the doctrine of a biblical ecclesiology. The following texts all reference the early church having multiple elders within one geographical assembly of saints:
*Acts 11:30
*Acts 14:23
*Acts 15:4,6
*Acts 15:22-23
*Acts 16:4
*Acts 20:17
*Acts 21:18
*Philippains 1:1
*1Tim. 4:14
*1 Tim. 5:17
*Titus 1:5
*James 5:14
*1 Peter 5:1

In examining the life of Adam, and all of those who have the Adamic nature (which is all of us), I am seeing a pattern. I've met many men who are still doing exactly what Adam did.

Adam was not strong enough to say no to Eve. Thus, by his sin he plunged the whole human race into depravity at the moment that he disobeyed God's command in the garden. In theology we call this the federal and natural headship doctrine (see Romans 5:12). Adam (which in the Hebrew is the name for mankind) represented mankind and inside of Adam was all of mankind to come. He failed to ask for help when approached by Eve in the time of temptation.

I suppose Adam, like any man, struggled with how to tell his closest and ONLY neighbor in love "no". In reality he actually failed to call upon God for strength and thus by his failure he ruined all of us. Of course, we were seminally present in him and had we been there we too would have done the very same thing. If we would have done anything different then surely God would have placed us there.

But I see the pattern of Adam replayed over and over in the lives of men who are married. One man came to me and admitted such. He said to me: "I am afraid of my wife. I'm afraid of loosing her if I stand up to her and do not give her what she wants I just want her to be happy."

I took him to 1 Cor. 7:33 where the Bible says: "But the married man is anxious about worldly things, how to please his wife, and his interests are divided." He read this and saw it as a reality in his own life. Over time he began to lean on the strength of the elders when he had to make a tough decision. He grew in his strength. It was not easy but he had a team of men standing behind him, encouraging him, and holding him accountable.

In another case a man in the fellowship had a very strong willed woman who basically led the home. In teaching and counseling he realized he had to step up to the plate to be the man and leader of the home. Yet his wife was so stubborn it took not only him but numerous elders(and some ladies in support of the men) to help turn the tables and the balance back to the correct side. I recall in one conversation where an elder told the man and wife that until he stood up to his wife she would not respect him. She agreed and actually admitted she longed for the day when she would not be able to push him around.

I've heard it said that sin is like weights over you. Sometimes a man alone cannot lift the weight off of him by himself. He may have over him a weight of 300 lbs and only have the strength to overcome 225lbs of resistance. He may need other brothers around him to gain that extra 75lbs of strength to be able to lift the weight and carry it.

It appears to me that a godly group of elders (plural) who are over the people under their care is one of the best ways in which men can have the guidance and strength needed to take the headship role in the home, especially if he has a large family.

Like Adam, when men venture out alone, as Adam did, experience seems to show that men will sometimes either be a dictator or a passive follower instead of a biblically balanced leader.

But if a man can find a team of men, a plural set of godly leaders to bond with, to look up to for guidance and strength in love and truth he may have a much better chance of turning the balance of the scales back towards being the faithful head of the home. A plurality of overssers in the church seems to be one of the best ways in which husbands can learn, grow, and receive the time and attention needed to be molded into the image of Christ, which in turn will flow into the home and unto the wives.

There seems to be great wisdom in God giving to each church a plural body of elders (overseers) in order that men may grow up in maturity. Maybe if more new church plants and more existing churches would embrace a plural body of mature overseers who rule in love and truth over the body more men could be discipled into being mature elders over the home and then in the church and then in the community.

Maybe this is one solution to some of the marital problems. We claim there is a lack of men to lead the home. This is often true. But maybe this is so because we sometimes have embraced a weak model of church government where one man tries to rule or where the rulers actually have no authority because the people control the leadership. Maybe if we give the reigns of authority back to a plural set of godly, competent, mature, doctrinally stable men (elders) then they can disciple men in the home to become good elders over their sheep (their family). Of course, I would not suggest this is the only answer to raise up strong men, but it sure does seem like one of the methods used in Scripture that has been lost in some fellowships today. Maybe if more returned to it more problems in marriages could be resolved and handled from the collective wisdom of the eldership.

Dr. Keith Allen
 
Dr. Keith,

I agree. There is some great wisdom here in this post. The elders are a wonderful resource for the body of believers and should be utilized as such. If there is an issue in the home sphere that cannot be resolved between the husband and wife, it should definitely be taken to the elders first (church sphere) to be settled. It is vitally important that we do not forsake the gathering of ourselves together with believers and submit ourselves to the Godly authority of the elders of the local church body. It goes back to being humble enough to ask for help and being submissive enough to receive that help when it is given. We all too often as humans attempt to strike out on our own because we think we can do it alone when in reality that is the very attitude that caused the human race to fall into sin to begin with. When we lean upon God and his strength and the strength of those people (especially those who are an authority over us) He puts around us, we are able to better make decisions and are stronger. However, when we refuse the wisdom of the bible that says "A cord of three strands is not easily broken" we are more likely to fail. When we have other brothers/sisters around us holding us up and holding us accountable, we are stronger in the Lord and stronger in our faith.

I am grateful for the protection that God has set up for women through the covering of their husband. Submission, when understood and practiced biblically, is a beautiful and wonderful thing. I think most women are like the woman you spoke of above and long for a man who is strong enough to say no. That in itself speaks volumes to his integrity. It tells me that he is strong and wise and can lead my heart well. If he were to listen to my every whim and bow to it, it would cause me to assume that he is weak. A weak man cannot effectively lead his wife's/wives' heart(s). I would not want such a man because it would prove that he cannot provide for me and cannot meet the protective needs of my heart. It is far better to have a man who has a balanced life and knows when to say yes and when to say no. This shows that he is a man of Godly wisdom and that he has not followed his sinful nature too far one way or the other. If he is too overbearing and refuses to listen to his wife on matters this is too far in the direction of pride and the "I can do it all by myself and I don't need anyone to help me" attitude. The other side of the pendulum is that he won't stand up to the wife and is ultimately pushed around by her. This is just as bad because he has the attitude that he doesn't have to do anything because it will be taken care of for him. The balance must be there so that he is firm when need be yet gentle when the pendulum swings to the other side.

Basically what it all boils down to is this: humility is the key. We must submit ourselves to a higher authority (whether the husband in the home, the elders in the church, or the rulers of the civil sector). If we do not, our lives will be in disorder and disarray. Our God is a God of order and balance and we should strive to be as such ourselves. We must battle the old man and die to self daily in order to live out the principles we know to be true.
 
Authority always follows this structue: one - to - many. Because of this authority can not be in hands of severals elders.

In any human group there is leader and follower(s). This rule is eternal.

Multitude of elders only makes sense if there are advisors. And, even then, it takes wisdom to recognize good advice.
Often advice only looks good, but it is actually dangerous.

Question for all men: Are you willing to lose women in your life for sake of truth and ethics?

If not, you will always be controled by your women.

Dr. Keith Allen said:
I recall in one conversation where an elder told the man and wife that until he stood up to his wife she would not respect him. She agreed and actually admitted she longed for the day when she would not be able to push him around.

This is truth.


No balls, no man.
No balls, only a child.
 
:?:

Huh?

I'm sorry but I'm not sure I understood that last post. Are you saying the bible does not speak of a plurality of elders in each church? Or are you saying something else?

Dr. Allen
 
Plurality is not required in the structure of authority, but often it is best. A man can be the authority figure for his wife in the event that he chooses to only have one wife; but the authority structure in the church is to be one - to - many. One God to many elders.
 
Oh sure. There is only one ultimate shepherd of the church (1 Peter 5:4), Jesus Christ. But he mediates his rule in each church through a body of plural elders (overseers), as the scriptures listed above speak about.

Thus, what I am saying is simply that the plural body of eleders is so often what is needed to help men mature and become strong enough to handle their own sins as well as the sins in their family. The pattern of the NT is simplt that of a plural set of elders who rule over the husbands who rule over their families.

So much of that is missing today and if restored that could one way to help aid families towards maturity.

Dr. Allen
 
Not only that but our young men are not taught, by fathers that can't teach, what they don't know. If we started with the youth and taught them, from the scriptures, how to become good men and husbands maybe the elders would have a little more time on their hands...I see the things that are clearly taught in the scriptures and as I discovered them by reading on my own I actually found myself a bit angry that neither the churches I had attended nor my own father (that didn't know better either) never taught me any of it.
 
Scarecrow,

So true. I am with you. I pray more elders will come into the ministry and will spend time teaching fathers how to be fathers and leaders in the home so in turn those fathers can teach their wives and children who will in turn grow up and do likewise with their family. A domino effect.

Dr. Allen
 
Dr. Keith Allen said:
Adam was not strong enough to say no to Eve.
i reject this assumption about adams motivation to eat of the fruit
it gives way too much power to the woman and thus the blame goes to her. it restarts the old "women are dangerous" theme

adam was standing right there and watched her her eat it. her did not try to protect her by talking her out of it. he saw that she did not die. he may have observed that, as her eyes were opened, she had new understanding that he did not have.
he chose to say no to the will of his Creator and yes to his own will.
 
steve said:
Dr. Keith Allen said:
he saw that she did not die. he may have observed that, as her eyes were opened, she had new understanding that he did not have.
he chose to say no to the will of his Creator and yes to his own will.

If you will look closely to the text Steve you'll see that Eve's eyes WERE NOT opened until AFTER Adam ate of the fruit. This is because Adam was what we call the federal and natural head of the human race. THe text is very specific on this matter. It says that She ate, gave to her husband and then or and (chronological) he ate then their eyes were opened (Gen. 3:7). It was not until Adam partook of the fruit that the human race fell into sin. His wife's eyes did not open until her head ate of the fruit. This aligns with other texts. For example, Paul specifically said that "sin came into the world through one man [Adam]" (Rom. 5:12). 1 Cor. 15:22 also shows us that that all in "Adam" "die." Eve was from Adam and in Adam in the sense that she was underneath him as her covenant head (federal headship doctrine).

This also squares with what Apostle Paul said when he spoke about the difference between Eve who was "deceived" but it was not "deceived" (1 Tim. 2:14). The point is that Adam knew what he was doing and deliberately rebelled. Eve, on the other hand, was deceived. Her sin was not one of deliberate rebellion.

Dr. Allen
 
nice job
completely ignore my only point and attack a peripheral one that was preceded and defined by he may have observed .......

on a side note, according to your "proof" that her eyes were opened only after adam ate of the fruit, i guess that this would mean that if adam had never eaten of it her eyes would have not been opened even though she ate of the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

interesting logic
 
I think you are both right…

According to 1 Timothy 2:14 Eve was deceived and was in transgression. The word used is:

παράβασις - parabasis - par-ab'-as-is - violation: - breaking, transgression.

But their eyes (meaning Adam and Eve both simultaneously) were not opened until Adam had also transgressed (Genesis 3:7), which was according to God’s discretion.

Had Eve’s eyes been opened prior to Adam also taking of the fruit, he may have seen Eve’s reaction and not eaten of the fruit. They knew they were naked and hid from God; Adam would have immediately noticed a different behavior in Eve and likely not eaten of the fruit.

God has only ever had one plan for the human race and it has always gone exactly according to his plan…He planned it this way, and it happened the way He planned it.
 
Scarecrow said:


Had Eve’s eyes been opened prior to Adam also taking of the fruit, he may have seen Eve’s reaction and not eaten of the fruit. They knew they were naked and hid from God; Adam would have immediately noticed a different behavior in Eve and likely not eaten of the fruit.
that assumption is possible, but it is still an assumption
it is also possible that adam saw understanding come upon her face and knew that she now had knowledge that he did not have
this may have been why he then chose to break the command. this possibility is also an assumption, but i willingly admit that it is.
1Cr 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 1Cr 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.
there is a higher authority than our own natural parsing of scripture, and if we ignore it we may find ourselves standing in front of the Judge pointing out to Him things in His word that He never put in there
 
Scarecrow said:

God has only ever had one plan for the human race and it has always gone exactly according to his plan…He planned it this way, and it happened the way He planned it.
well, that is one view
 
Re: issue #1. A plurality of elders. For those that have served in pastoral ministry, the idea is attractive. To have brothers of like mind and heart standing shoulder to shoulder in the vineyard of God is a blessing. Jesus sent the disciples out in twos. Paul generally traveled in company. While these are not pastorqal works in essence, they do reflect support for the concept of plural elders. However, plural elders should not be conceived as a committee function (remember a camel is a horse put together by a committee). As earlier noted, biblical leadership is by example most always one to many, requiring a leading elder among those who serve.
issue #2. Adam & Eve, when God was judging Adam, Eve and the serpent, He said Adam's primary issue was that Adam hearkened to the voice of his wife, rather than God. Adam made a concious choice, and we replicate it often by giving preference to the will of our wives over the will and Word of God.
 
Steve…Both are indeed only scenarios. There is no mention of any discernible change in Eve until after their eyes were opened. Therefore it is theologically prudent to assume the status quo is intact until such time that we are given information to cause us to think otherwise. What we do know is that after their eyes were opened they considered themselves to be naked and hid from God, a considerable change to their behavior. So after their eyes were opened we do see a change in behavior, but not before, therefore it is very likely that there was no change in Eve's demeanor until her eyes were opened along with Adam's.

To insinuate that we as humans have the capability of thwarting God’s plans is to question His omnipotence. The scriptures are replete with examples of God’s sovereignty and foreknowledge. If God had a plan, but then we ruined it and He had to go to plan B then plan C then plan D etc... to make adjustments because of our activities, then I wouldn’t consider Him much of a god.
 
Adam was not strong enough to say no to Eve.
He said Adam's primary issue was that Adam hearkened to the voice of his wife, rather than God.
hmmm, is it the same thing?
1) to hear, listen to, obey

a) (Qal)

1) to hear (perceive by ear)

2) to hear of or concerning

3) to hear (have power to hear)

4) to hear with attention or interest, listen to

5) to understand (language)

6) to hear (of judicial cases)

7) to listen, give heed

a) to consent, agree

b) to grant request

8) to listen to, yield to

9) to obey, be obedient
did he obey her, or just listen to her and then make the wrong decision?
if he listened to her, what was she saying
she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
no mention that she spoke any words to him.
i submit that it could be more complicated than we might at first assume
 
To insinuate that we as humans have the capability of thwarting God’s plans is to question His omnipotence. The scriptures are replete with examples of God’s sovereignty and foreknowledge. If God had a plan, but then we ruined it and He had to go to plan B then plan C then plan D etc... to make adjustments because of our activities, then I wouldn’t consider Him much of a god.
wow
i am sure that brighter men than myself have argued this one out and it wearies me out just contemplating it.
we all will be required to give an account of what we teach and whether or not we mislead the less knowledgeable, i would be very concerned was i you
 
steve said:
i am sure that brighter men than myself have argued this one out and it wearies me out just contemplating it.
we all will be required to give an account of what we teach and whether or not we mislead the less knowledgeable, i would be very concerned was i you

I think maybe the question should be asked if He knew before hand that we would refuse to do what He wanted us to do? If this is the case, then of course, He already knows what we will choose and has planned accordingly. He never forced Jonah, but let him run and then Jonah suffered the consequences of his actions. Sometimes we have to learn by suffering the consequences of our actions.

Scott
 
mrscottyl said:
I think maybe the question should be asked if He knew before hand .................
and therein lies the question
of course He can know every decision that we will ever make and plan accordingly, but does He? let the Holy Spirit lead you on that one
 
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