• Biblical Families is not a dating website. It is a forum to discuss issues relating to marriage and the Bible, and to offer guidance and support, not to find a wife. Click here for more information.

I need help!!!

D

DanielM

New Member
Hello all.

I am new to this community as of today, but I have spent every spare minute of the last two days reading these forums. I have a situation that I have not seen addressed yet. And that is what I call "a failed first attempt". My wife and I have both been believers since childhood, both raised in christian homes.
We have been married of seven years now, I first talked with her about plural marriage about a year and a half after we got married, it did not go well to say the least. It was a disaster and very messy. It took us a long time to recover. She felt betrayed, angry, and un loved. I was young, ignorant, impatient and didn't have answered for her.

The result was that I basically gave up on the subject and we started healing.

Where I sit now is, this subject has been on my heart this whole time, it hasn't "just gone away".
I truly believe that biblical plural marage is good and right and blessed by God, and I desire it greatly.
The truth is that I am terrified to try to talk with my wife about it again.

Any wisdom and insight would be greatly appreciated.


Thanks

Daniel.
 
I haven't been in your situation before, as my wife was not so resistant to the idea, but a few thoughts come to mind that I hope will be helpful. Others have been there and may have more to say.

PRAY. And think about a few things.

First thing you need to understand:
What was your wife horrified about when you brought it up before? The theology that says plural marriage is not a sin, or the idea that she might have to share you with someone else? Because those are two separate issues. There are plenty of people for instance who realise it is not a sin, but don't believe it is right for them, and there is nothing wrong with that as God's plans for everybody's lives are different. These two very separate issues need to be considered separately, and discussed separately if that is at all possible.

Second thing you need to understand:
Why do you want to bring this up with your wife at all? Do you find it an interesting theological point that you'd like her to believe also so you can both have a better understanding of God? Do you think it might be something God could call you to do some day, maybe? Or do you have another woman in mind you believe God is giving you?

After thinking and praying carefully about these points, you may be better able to understand where and how to go from here.

My gut feeling is that if you know God is giving you another wife now, then this is something you need to work on hard and try to persuade your wife about, in order to follow God's lead in your life. In that case, start with the theological side of things, getting her to look into things as much as possible. And most importantly, pray hard.

But if you just think it's an interesting idea, maybe for the future, then it isn't urgent. You don't need to persuade her now, or possibly ever, as God may not intend you to have a second wife for many years if at all. You have plenty of time to pray for her and wait for God to change her mind. There are some people here who have lost wives over this issue. Your current wife is far more important than a possible future wife when you don't even know whether or not she exists. There is no sense pushing her too hard and ending up single. Do your best to be a good husband to her, leading her in a wise and Godly manner in all other aspects of your lives, and ask God to guide her thoughts so that if He does give you an "interesting" future, she'll be ready for it then.

You'll obviously have a particularly hard job persuading her if you try, and are at a higher risk than some of losing her over the issue, given your past. I don't think you can do it. But God can. Hand the job over to Him.
 
FollowingHim,

First off, thank you for your insights. They have given me food for thought and prayer today.

When we discussed this before, we didn't get into the theology much, I tried to give her the biblical grounds for what I was suggesting. But she didn't want to hear it. She was too wrap up in the thought of "loosing her husband". The way she took it was that there was something wrong with her, why else would I want to consider taking a second wife.


As to why I want to talk about this again,
I believe that it is possible the God will lead us down the road of plural marriage, again, it is something that I desire.
This is where I need wisdom, I have no idea at this point, how, when or IF I should bring this up again.
I am praying that the Lord will work on her heart and mind and that she will bring it up or someone will bring it up to her.
There is a youn woman that I want to take as my second wife but I definatly do not feel that I have the green light yet.
She is a dear friend of both mine and my wife's. She is a very stong believer and will be in need of a husband soon.
I don't know what she believes about plural marrage however, or if she has everv realy thought about or considered it.

I have had no clear word from the Lord yet as to wether He is going to give me this woman or not. What I do know is that this has been on my heart for over five years now (long before I ever met this young woman)so I am trying to decern if this be the Lords timing .

Both my wife and I have grown greatly in our faith in the Lord and our trust and Love for one another.I have asked her to do a study on marrage with me, a cover to cover look at what scriptuer has to say about it. She agreed whole heartedly. My hope is that through this study she will see the truth of this.

I agree with you, that I cant do this myself I tryed and failed, it is an exersize
in faith for me to believe that God can and will work in this.
 
DanielM said:
When we discussed this before, we didn't get into the theology much, I tried to give her the biblical grounds for what I was suggesting. But she didn't want to hear it. She was too wrap up in the thought of "loosing her husband".
Click to expand...
You've probably hit there on the key point why the first discussion didn't go well. That time you probably handled it backwards, this time it's got to be about God's word first and foremost.

There is a youn woman that I want to take as my second wife but I definatly do not feel that I have the green light yet.
She is a dear friend of both mine and my wife's. She is a very stong believer and will be in need of a husband soon.
Click to expand...
You've got a very good reason to start back into this issue now then. Just wondering though, why do you say she "will be in need of a husband soon"?

Both my wife and I have grown greatly in our faith in the Lord and our trust and Love for one another.I have asked her to do a study on marrage with me, a cover to cover look at what scriptuer has to say about it. She agreed whole heartedly. My hope is that through this study she will see the truth of this.
Click to expand...
This sounds an excellent way to approach the issue to me. Just make sure you make it a genuine study on marriage from your perspective too, as I am sure there is much both of you can learn (as we all can). If it's just a thinly-veiled attempt to bring her around to your point of view on this one point (which is only one aspect of marriage), and you put too much effort into discussing that, it could backfire on you badly ("I trusted you, I thought we were going to get closer to God together, but you don't really care about me at all, you just want to sleep with X..."). You've got to be genuine.

If God's plan is for you to have a second wife, He will also have a plan to make it happen. And that plan could well be quite different to anything you can plan or imagine. Keep praying.
 
You've got a very good reason to start back into this issue now then. Just wondering though, why do you say she "will be in need of a husband soon"?
Click to expand...
If I understand scripture right, a woman needs a man as her head, be that a father or husband. She will soon be out of her fathers house, she is done with college next spring. That means to me that she will be in need of a husband, be that me or some other man doesn't change the need.

This sounds an excellent way to approach the issue to me. Just make sure you make it a genuine study on marriage from your perspective too, as I am sure there is much both of you can learn (as we all can). If it's just a thinly-veiled attempt to bring her around to your point of view on this one point (which is only one aspect of marriage), and you put too much effort into discussing that, it could backfire on you badly ("I trusted you, I thought we were going to get closer to God together, but you don't really care about me at all, you just want to sleep with X..."). You've got to be genuine.
Click to expand...
Thank you for bringing this up. It is somthing I have thought of, to me it is an issue of the heart and it's motives. So, I have been asking God to judge my motives and to work on me to make me a man that can love more than one woman.
I recognize that most of the work to be done is on me, because if I am truly loving my wife as Christ loved the church, then there would be no doubt in her mind that my love is unfailing, that she can trust me absolutly. I have a long way to go.
My hopes for this study are, that she will come to see that plural marriage is good and blessed by God, that she and I will deepen in our relationship with each other and God and that our relationship will continue to grow to better reflect Christ.
So, no, my only motive is not to change her mind so I can have this other woman too, but it is one motive.


Thanks for your input.

Daniel
 
DanielM said:
If I understand scripture right, a woman needs a man as her head, be that a father or husband. She will soon be out of her fathers house, she is done with college next spring. That means to me that she will be in need of a husband, be that me or some other man doesn't change the need.
Click to expand...
Why does she need to be in her father's house to have him as her head?

Don't think she needs a husband and someone must step up to the plate, so you have to work out now if it's you. Relax and wait for God to reveal His plans in His time.
 
You make a good point. I suppose I was understanding this in a more litteral sence of physical proxemity. After all, while any young woman my be in full sumition to her father while not under the same roof the issue of protection gets complicated. How is a father to protect his daughter if she is a distance away. I am not trying to argue, these are just the thoughts I am having. I am not trying to be in a hurry, that was one of my many mistakes last time around.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Daniel
 
I'm looking at this headship thing from the opposite end I think. I'd say he is her head, whether she likes it or not and whether she lives with him or not. It is his responsibility how he is going to care for her, whether he decides to keep her at home or send her into the world trusting that he's taught her well enough to take care of herself. Unless he's a complete moron and doesn't care for her at all, don't worry about headship in her case.
 
I have to agree, your make a good point.
As I have been thinking about what you have been saying, I see that I am still trying to justify what I believe and my desire. This is differant than knowing my mind and why I want to do somthing.
For example, I say "I want to go for a walk" and someone asks me why. I say "because I like to walk and it is a beautiful day". This is knowing my mind and why I want to do somthing.There is nothing wrong with the activity.
Justifying is when I ask my four year old "why did you hit your sister"? and he gives me a reason that he thinks will make his actions not wrong, like "she hit me first". There is somthing wrong with his actions.
I guess I am still wrapping my mind around the fact that there is nothing wrong with desiring to marry this young woman. I have never been able to talk this out with any one without being judged as a "carnal, lustfull sinner" and that they would do anything they could to "get me the help that I need", believing that I needed to be fixed.
I cant tell you how wonderful it is to be able to talk to people of the same mind.

Thanks for listening and helping me work through this.

Daniel
 
FollowingHim has been offering great advice, DanielM. I'll just add the following, if you don't mind:

In case it occurs to you, as the devil will probably make sure it does at some point, that the grass is greener on the other side of the fence, and it would be worth losing your current relationship over ... it isn't. It is, at most, a different shade of green.

You have a COVENANT with your first wife. If she blows up, and divorces you, and disappears into the wild blue yonder, that is on her. If you forge angrily ahead, blaming her for not excitedly falling in with your grand new scheme at the speed you think she should, ... *tsk, tsk*

I know you don't intend to. Just an early warning. It is a common tactic the devil employs. With too much success!

Blessings on you as your story unfolds, my friend.

And yeah ... You like her, and could see yourself across the breakfast table from her for the next 70 years is justification enough! But remember the old saw ... look at her mom & g'ma. In 20 or 40 years ... :)
 
I dont mind at all, thats why I am here :)
In case it occurs to you, as the devil will probably make sure it does at some point, that the grass is greener on the other side of the fence, and it would be worth losing your current relationship over ... it isn't. It is, at most, a different shade of green.
Click to expand...
This is somthing that I pray over every day. I will not push this to the point of destroying my marrage. "what GOD has joined let NO ONE seperate" that meens me too.

As I mentioned earlyer on in this thread, I proposed to my wife that we do a cover to cover study about marrage. In just the last two days as I have sat before GOD and thought and prayed over our mairrage, I am growing in my love for my wife and I am starting to understand the GOD is the head of Christ, husband is the head of wife relasionship like I have not before. So wether all this study and pray has the result of God giving me this woman or not, I am in the word and in prayer on a daily basis with my wife at my side, we are growing closer and being changed to reflect Christ more as individuals and in our mairrage.

I would greatly appriciate your prayers, that He will give me paciance, wisdome and most of all love.
Oh and by the way, her mother is a lovely woman in every way. ;)
Thanks fore your thoughts.

Daniel
 
DanielM said:
In just the last two days as I have sat before GOD and thought and prayed over our mairrage, I am growing in my love for my wife and I am starting to understand the GOD is the head of Christ, husband is the head of wife relasionship like I have not before. So wether all this study and pray has the result of God giving me this woman or not, I am in the word and in prayer on a daily basis with my wife at my side, we are growing closer and being changed to reflect Christ more as individuals and in our mairrage.
Click to expand...
That is exactly the experience my wife and I have had as we've studied this issue together. It's amazing how something most people think is bad for marriage actually draws you closer together. Shows there's something in it that the rest of the church is missing...


Well done realising that you were trying to justify why you want to marry her using some honourable-sounding reason.
CecilW said:
You like her, and could see yourself across the breakfast table from her for the next 70 years is justification enough!
Click to expand...
Dead right, and to be honest finding her hot enough to want in your bed is a wholesome reason too. "Good Christians" don't generally talk about that because it's "dirty" or some such nonsense, but I'll bet that was part of your thinking when you decided to marry your current wife. Why not your second too?

Notice that wanting to spend your life with her and wanting to take her to bed are desires, not compulsions. You are not required to marry her because of them. So this makes it seem like these reasons are not "good enough".

So you then invent some urgent reason why you HAVE to marry her so you can persuade others. But this will be the wrong reason, because you invented it. The risk is that you might believe it yourself, and rush into trying to marry her for this wrong reason - possibly marrying at the wrong time, or even the wrong woman, or maybe just losing your first wife and failing to marry the second either...

The real reasons, the right reasons, don't require you to act fast. You can take your time. You've got a whole life ahead to spend with her, what's a year or two? You're already married, so there is no reason for lust to tempt you to act quickly either. The right reasons (even sexual attraction) allow patience.
 
Thank you all for your encouragment and insight. I can't tell you how helpful it has been to be able to talk this through with like minded belivers and not be judged.

Somthing else that has been on my mind is this, why should we push this issue? We don't have a direct command so why not just let sleeping dogs lie? I know that we are to live in the Truth but to me this is a hard question to answer partly because it appears to be so self serving to people who don't agree with us.

Thoughts, comments?

Daniel
 
DanielM said:
why should we push this issue? We don't have a direct command so why not just let sleeping dogs lie? I know that we are to live in the Truth but to me this is a hard question to answer partly because it appears to be so self serving to people who don't agree with us.
Click to expand...

1. Ordering to abstain from marriage is a doctrine of devils (ref: somewhere in Timothy). No restriction is placed on that judgment allowing us to say 1st marriages are ok, additional marriages are not. Do we really want doctrines of devils mixed into our theology?

2. Monogamist doctrine places us in a judgment seat against the Patriarchs who walked and talked with God face to face, and whom God called men after His own heart. Do we really want to do that? More immediately, it places us in judgment against those who choose to live the same way today.

3. It also accuses God of a) being too shy to TELL humans it was wrong, b) giving us an imperfect law, c) practicing sin Himself even if only in allegory. And choosing the wrong method of dealing with uneven demographics. Yikes. Do we really wanna side with the accuser?

4. Monogamist thinking does NOT provide for every woman to live in a marriage relationship. Poly does. God hears the single woman's tears of loneliness as much as He hears the heart cry of those who got lucky and paired up already. Remember, He said that being alone is NOT GOOD.

5. Poly goes hand-in-glove with Patriarchy, something which needs to be restored in remedy of our disintegrating society and epidemic of fatherlessness and husbandlessness.

6. Any particular reason why our freedom in Christ should be curtailed by pagan traditions, when Jesus specifically condemned us teaching them as doctrines? Do we really wanna give up our freedom just 'cause someone disapproves?

7. Monogamy does not allow for the proper handling of non-optimal situations, such as a man dying childless or a fella getting too involved with an unmarried gal.

8. It is never safe to turn one's back on truth discovered, merely because it is inconvenient or unpopular.

9. Monogamist doctrine creates confusion. There is so much scripture that comes unraveled and leaves loose ends blowing in the breeze and making no sense. Whereas a poly mindset leaves everything neatly connected and tucked into place.

10. While the individual believer's salvation is not dependant upon his accepting or practicing poly, so far as I can tell, there are salvation issues that make more sense and can be seen in greater depth from a poly point of view.

11. The poly mindset requires us to do some stretching and growing internally -- both men and women! You have to do an internal work of opening your heart, expanding love, becoming willing to share, becoming willing to accept additional responsibilities, accept potential persecution, and basically make room for an additional person before someone can enter. Whether someone then does enter your family or not, you have experienced worthwhile growth.

12. The devil hates Godly poly and patriarchy. It tends to fill the world with more people whose lives are ordered and modeled in a godly way. He argues for celibacy when he can. But when that doesn't work, he argues for monogamy, and then tries to get the woman to insist on taking the leadership / headship role, requiring the man to submit. Both positions are opposite to the Word of God, and thus anti-Christ.

13. Even in marriages that do not actually end up adding a second wife, the very possibility of doing so tends to make or break the marriage. It does this by forcing to the surface any problems that have been pushed down and adapted to. They then either end up getting resolved, or the marriage ends. If resolved, the marriage is healthier than ever. If it ends, sometimes that allows time for each partner to do their own internal work and then they get back together. If not, a foundationless structure has crumbled, and an opportunity is now present to start over and build right.

14. ... ? Someone else chime in.
 
It might or might not be right for your family. But it will be right for someone else. How will they know this could be God's solution to their situation if someone doesn't tell them it is ok?

There are so many good Christian single women who could do with a Godly husband. There are so many men who have made mistakes and need to know how to best deal with the results, caring for and respecting both women involved.

"How will they hear without a preacher?" (Romans 10:14)
 
Hello,
I have been involved in plural marriage and also on these forums for several years now, although not so much recently on the forums. I find that I am still learning and growing and discovering new facets.

I had an "a ha" moment the other day as I was trying to explain it to hubby. The hard thing for me to get my head around (although I have no problem with poly) is the idea that there is something lacking in our marriage that he needs another wife. This is not a criticism of him so much as a new way of looking at things.

When I think hubby wants another wife because there is something lacking in me, I feel like a failure and that I am inadequate all by myself. When I let myself believe that this desire or need would be there even if I were perfect in every way (Impossible, I know) then it is easier to realize that it isn't a condemnation on me. Once I let go of that thought, it is easier to embrace the idea.

As women, we are raised (even those raised in Christian homes) that we can (should) have it all. We must be the perfect mate, mother, housekeeper, laundress, cook and lover. If we work outside the home we must also be a great example in the workplace. So if hubby then says, I think I would like another wife, the wife is going to say to herself "What have I not done for him that he needs another wife?" Or worse, she considers herself a failure. If a wife can let go of the need to be "perfect" then it is easier to accept that another wife is desired or needed without taking it as a personal failure. And if we don't see the new wife as the result of our imperfections, then it is easier to love her and therefore take her into our family.

No, I am not saying that this is the only problem or even a major one. I am saying that this is one facet of the many different issues that come up when discussing plural marriage with a wife.

SweetLissa
 
We must be the perfect mate, mother, housekeeper, laundress, cook and lover
Click to expand...

I think one of the benefits of plural marriage is you get to do what you are good at and let the other person do what they are good at. It is a win win.
 
May I take that whole idea one step further, Lissa?

"If I were the perfect Christian, then God wouldn't need or want the rest of y'all."

Is that good reasoning or faulty? It's horrid, actually, right? But why?

Why does God want more than one of us? Could it be as simple as ... He is Love?

The Bible tells us that the family is a micro version of the Heavenly family. So ...

Could the reason that a godly man, one who is sold out to Christ and connected with him, want another wife for a reason no more complex than ... he is also Love?

Nothing to do with lack in you. Simply to do with abundant love in him?

Would that help? (Please note my new Doc-like technique of asking lots of questions. :lol: )
 
Sweetlissa, that is a brilliant perspective, and it got my wife and I talking a lot - and Cecil's post is spot-on also. It's helpful to look at it around the other way too, and put the first wife in the second wife's shoes.

As I told my wife "Even if I already was married to her, and she was perfect, I'd still want you - because I love you".
 
Thank you all for your comments and insights, they have been very helpfull.
Since my last post, I have had a huge answer to prayer. I have been able to bring this suject up to my wife again.
Last time we talked about it we didnt resolve it. I just droped it in order to make peace. This time I was able to talk about it in the light of how I handled it badly last time, because I felt there was still healing that needed to happed, because I felt that things went badly because she didnt feel loved. We where able to agree to take this issue out from between us and put it out where we can discuss it without being in opposition to each other and to let the light of the truth of scripture decide. She is scared but willing.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top