Please continue to read your Bible. Acts 16:32 Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house.
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Polygyny IS a salvation issue.
- Thread starter BiblicalLiteralist
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Please continue to read your Bible. Acts 16:32 Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house.
Do you have any specific verses that you think contradict Acts 16:30-31? I assume you’re saying Acts 16 is false since you imply it contradicts the as yet unidentified verses in John?
"Then they spoke the word of the Lord."
One thing our generation overlooks is the fact that the torah, writings, and prophets were being preached in every city on the Shabbat.
For example, Timothy (gentile) knew the Holy Scriptures from childhood:
2 Timothy 3:15
You have been taught the Holy Scriptures from childhood, and they have given you the wisdom to receive the salvation that comes by trusting in Christ Jesus.
Acts 15:21
For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.
They were likely reading the Septuagint (Greek old testament) for the torah, writings, and prophets. It was the common language in the Eastern Mediterranean Region. For this is a fulfillment of the Scriptures:
Mark 1:3
He is a voice shouting in the wilderness, ‘Prepare the way for the LORD’s coming! Clear the road for him!’” (Isaiah 40:3)
You think that YHVH was only preparing the path in Judea? Do you not see that he was also preparing the path in the gentile regions - by having the Septuagint read every Shabbat - for at least a few hundred years before the coming of the Messiah? The Septuagint was released around 300 BC.
In the Septuagint - the book of Joshua - is called the book of Iēsous in the Septuagint. So the name Iēsous - was being read out loud for hundreds of years before the actual Messiah showed up. That's because Iēsous is a Greek translation of Joshua - which is a english translation of the Hebrew name - YAHUshua. YAH is Salvation. Jesus is simply a translation of the Greek Iēsous - into english - Jesus. It doesn't go back to the original word - "Joshua" (Yahushua) - which Iesous is a translation of. Even the 1611 KJV bible used Iesus. The older Geneva bible as well.
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I'm not saying it is false. But instead would like to propose a question. What does believe mean? Does true belief result in a change of heart?
2 Corinthians 5:17
This means that anyone who belongs to Christ has become a new person. The old life is gone; a new life has begun!
Mark 2:22
And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. For the wine would burst the wineskins, and the wine and the skins would both be lost. New wine calls for new wineskins.
A new heart built on the belief in the Master Yahushua the Messiah (Jesus Christ) - can accept the sanctification through the word of truth (new wine). But if you try to give this word of truth (new wine) to a non-believer - it's not going to work - it's just going to go from one ear to another. Some of them may even trample over you, because they can't stand what his Word says. Hence you can't put new wine into old wineskins. New wine calls for new wineskins.
Ephesians 4:21-23
Since you have heard about Jesus and have learned the truth that comes from him, 22 throw off your old sinful nature and your former way of life, which is corrupted by lust and deception. 23 Instead, let the Spirit renew your thoughts and attitudes. 24 Put on your new nature, created to be like God—truly righteous and holy.
Colossians 2:11
When you came to Christ, you were “circumcised,” but not by a physical procedure. Christ performed a spiritual circumcision—the cutting away of your sinful nature.
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I don't know what the above has to do with what is written in Acts 16:30-32; And he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.” Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house. This passage indicates Paul taught salvation is by grace alone, through faith alone, in Jesus Christ alone, and that he taught the whole counsel of Scripture so the person could understand everything necessary. Cheers
It does seem remarkably clear.
The point was that they likely had a better idea of the path of righteousness than most believers today. Most Christians don't even know what adultery means, which even the Egyptian pharaoh in Abram's time had a better understanding.
Acts 18:11
So Paul stayed there for the next year and a half, teaching the word of God.
It doesn't take that long to teach a few commandments, and that Jesus is Lord.
True believers - like I mentioned in my previous post - will receive a new heart that can accept the new wine that comes with it, and then have the fruit that comes with it. Non-believers will look for false teachers to tell them what their itching ears want to hear. That's the difference.
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The reality is Salvation from the condemnation of sin is the same today as it was that day in Acts 16 when Paul spoke to the jailer. Don't add to or take from the truth. There was just as much ignorance of the truth then as there is today, and just as much need for the sinner to be taught the whole counsel of Scripture.
The reality:
There are Jews that say they are Jews, but they are of the synagogue of Satan. (Revelation 3:9)
They are Christians that say they are Christians, but are actually children of the Devil. (1 John 3:10)
There is a narrow path that few find. (Matthew 7:13)
If it's as simple as you say - it would be a very wide path - and the devil wouldn't work so hard deceiving the Christian nations.
Reality doesn't conform with your method of cherry picking verses.
If I understand your response correctly, you are saying there is a need for a modification of the gospel the Apostles proclaimed so that sinners today can be saved. What do you think needs to be added or altered to what was taught to save sinners in the time of the book of Acts so that sinners can be saved today? For me, I'll continue to read and teach the whole counsel of Scripture just as Paul did.
What does it mean to "believe ON Him?"
It's not the same as just "believe IN Him," because "even the devils believe [i.e., that He exists] and tremble." (James 2:19)
So it must mean something more. How about just "believe Him?" That He means every word He said. Was, Is, and Will Be, Who He Is.
And if He really is "echad" (in unity) with the Father YHVH, as He said, and John is right, that He was there from the Beginning as an element of that Unity, then He means every word "from Genesis to Maps."
"Why do you call Me, Lord, LORD, but NOT do the things I say?" (Luke 6:46)
"If you love Me, keep My commandments." (John 14:15)
There's even John 5:37-47.
Man this thread derailed rather quickly! You would think we were in the ghetto!
Back to the original topic of discussion, I have to second @FollowingHim2 that polygyny is certainly not salvific. We do often hear from others though, who doubt that we are saved. Not too long ago, the pastor of the church we have been attending, told me that he does NOT doubt my salvation, even though he knows my position on this issue. Contrast that with a conversation I had with someone here, whose pastor told him that he DOES doubt that this man is even saved. One reason I believe my pastor does not doubt my salvation, is that I have been an active part of the church's outreach evangelism ministry. I have give reports on how we asked the critical question of what a person thinks it takes to go to heaven, and for one or two, who have received Christ and His offer of salvation. "Salvation issue" has nothing to do with ghetto. Adding requirements to the free gift of salvation does.
I know I am a little late replying to the topic but I don’t believe it’s a salvation issue as much as the modern church ties it to being a salvation issue because they will make comments such as you can’t be saved if you believe that something so sinful like polygyny is acceptable.
I do agree with the original about how the modern church easily accepts other truly sinful conditions and circumstances over what we all know and believe is not sinful. For example, I have seen women get pregnant outside of marriage throwing these girls baby showers etc. which I am not saying don’t rally around her and be a support but are they addressing the sin when they allow her to stay in the choir and be active in children’s church? Yet, they will kick practicing polygynist to the corner.
I do agree with the original about how the modern church easily accepts other truly sinful conditions and circumstances over what we all know and believe is not sinful. For example, I have seen women get pregnant outside of marriage throwing these girls baby showers etc. which I am not saying don’t rally around her and be a support but are they addressing the sin when they allow her to stay in the choir and be active in children’s church? Yet, they will kick practicing polygynist to the corner.
It sounds like you want salvation to be all there is, salvation is the beginning of the journey. It can also be the complete journey in some cases but as long as as we’re in the physical realm we have to keep on the journey.
You’re wanting to use a spiritual transporter beam, beam me up Peter! It doesn’t work like that. The transporter beam is physical death. Until then you have to keep walking.
Salvation sets you moving in a direction, something that has to happen if you’re ever going to get somewhere, and if you travel in the right direction then eventually you’ll get a ride the last little bit. But you have to start along and that’s salvation.
What has long been called the "left foot of fellowship" here is so common among xtianity as to be 'passe'. Many of their 'doctrines of men, not of YHVH,' (Mark ) are admittedly "not salvific." Even some Baptists might admit that dancing isn't necessarily a ticket straight to hell.
And all the talk of Acts 15, 16, and similar, do seem to focus on "minimums." As in, "what's the very least I can do and STILL slip through, by the skin of my teeth, even, into heaven?" As opposed to what I contend SHOULD be our goal, to hear, "Well done, good and faithful servant."
But all of that ignores what I still contend is the 'elephant in the room,' for this thread. Not only the fact that Yahushua warned (Matthew 7, repeatedly) about the path to life being "narrow," but that MANY take the wide path to destruction. And Paul (twice in Galatians 1, and in II Cor. 11) warned people -- even back then, already! -- being deceived by "another jesus, whom we have NOT preached."
Does one who changes his mind about polygyny, and thus is NOT the "same, yesterday, today, and tomorrow" fit that bill?
And if you "believe on" another jesus, instead of the Real One, what does that buy you?
But he also went on to say that it is God who works in you both to will and to do His good pleasure.