@paterfamilias, I've got to be honest with you here. Being in agreement on spiritual matters with your wives is crucially important.
it is certainly impirtand definitely ideal...crucial? Could be in many cases. But it is not a universal must have.
There is a fundamental principle here which you have no doubt heard before - Christians are explicitly instructed to not be "unequally yoked with unbelievers". In other words, when we are working alongside someone much of the time ("yoked"), we need to be in agreement on much more than just the job at hand. This applies to all of life - it's why people tend to gravitate towards people of the same religion and politics in business for instance - but applies most strongly to marriage, because that is the part of life people are most closely yoked together.
Super aware of it. In fact I think i have been modernly kind to the group in that I only go into my unconscious lecture mode on the topic as it relates to evolutionary psychology (one of my pet topics I have taken more than a little interest in for the last several years) and how the modern world is seeming insane with respect to creating artificial pressure to push differing groups together under the laughably transparent grift of creating "strength".
So, yeah...I know that unions of like and like are strongest. Not a new idea.
So, much as you seem to be a great guy, I don't think a Christian wife is what you should be looking for.
Where did you get the idea that I am looking for a Christian wife? I am fairly certain it was not from me.
To my memory, whether it was here, in a long defunct similar site or any other platform where I have discussed polygamy, my line has been along the lines of saying that while I do not have a faith that I am extremely aware of the value of faith and very happy to support a wife in her faith.
I may have even gone so far as to say that I prefer a woman who has faith. Not 100% on that though.
My reasons go back to my own point of view and understanding of my pet topic I mentioned earlier.
I do have a counter question here for you though.
Less in this environment though not entirely absent by any means but in other Christian/Biblical forums or the like, I have regularly encounter attitudes which wildly differ on who qualifies as Christian. I know that the Mormons get rather a lot of stick on the topic by way of example.
Consider if you will for a moment the position of an outsider looking in and consider that to an outsider that the many sects seem to have a lot of the central beliefs and messages in common but just vary in detail. In a few cases those details are enough to get one sect entirely rejected by other sects. You will likely be a far better content expert than I on this but I am fairly sure that the Jehova's witness and the Unitarians fall into that category. Of the three I can think of I only know enough to comment vaguely intelligently on the Mormons and that is more about liking there tight knit, family oriented and prepper friendly attitudes which I imagine stem from their faith but I am happy to be corrected.
So, with the fact that some sects reject other sects, is that going to make for a tougher match between those sects or do you think the oddball like me who has yet to be touched by anything but lauds faith broadly speaking is still a worse grenade to roll under the tent?
You're really looking for a morally conservative wife. You are considering a Christian one simply because where you live most atheist women are nuts, and it's only the Christians that have remained sane.
Ha! LOL! Are you telling me that your atheists are not lunatics with personalities like 40 grit sandpaper and drark triad traits out the wazoo? Cause I pay an enormous amount of attention to politics. Up to and including y'all's politics and I see so very much of the same lunacy and tyranny that is going on here and through all of the western world with what even I will call demonic intentions. My money is on if those bloody people have any sort of faith, that it has to do with horns and hooves.
And I can completely understand that attraction. But this conservative culture that you value can only be preserved by marrying those same Christian women off to other Christian men who will create Christian families that will continue that culture.
Hand waggle. Again, struggling to not go lecture mode. This is very much an evolutionary psychology linked issue so it is something that has been prominent in my mind for...lets call it a long time. I tend to see it as a bit of Column A and a bit of Column B. Yes it is ideal but as I noted earlier, not a requirement.
Woman were once seen as overt propery and traded between groups. Some would say like livestock, others would argue to cement alliances and maintain good will and others would point to the need to maintain fresh good as it were. Obviously not the case any longer but it was certainly within that sort of furnace that much of early Christians and their predecessors in faith were forged.
So while everyone will have their own variation and spin on how they see this topic, you will forgive my skepticism with respect to my not being a good choice for a Christian, a Mormon if we are to parse them out or some of the others above or to the side or another oddball who remains untouched by faith...suppose a sane atheist might be acceptable but if I would be a tougher sale than for some Christian woman...an atheist would be a harder sell for me. Some of them are rigid and dogmatic. This is where I would put in a smily face to show that the last remark amuses me but I don't know how to make them.
" Marrying outside the faith, even to a decent man, is the first step towards diluting the influence of Christianity on the culture, and ending up with the very liberal atheist culture that you despise."
(forgive the formatting in the reply going screwy. I was dictating a bit here and typing a bit there while working the smoker in the middle of the night and anytime I set the phone down to start swinging on and cursing the mosquitoes, the page refreshed on me and the format was weird)
I think that is far more of a case by case issue. I personally know plenty of guys who say they are a Christian and who have wives who are practicing and observant Christians and full on church ladies. The guys Never set foot in a church. Hells bells, they don't even show up for the potlucks where their wives made half the dishes and they are paying for it. I am pretty much describing the environment I grew up in in fact and I know I am not unique in my experience.
There are families that colour themselves as Christians and the kids are not baptized and the parents literally are not sure when beyond their wedding was the last time they were in a church...oh wait, yeah it was when they were in Italy and they went in so many of the cathedrals and quaint little churches to get pictures.
Fairly sure you get my point.
I am not the best choice for some Christian women...certainly. Am I the worst choice? Insert shrug here. Consider me bias on the topic.
I do know that if a wife's faith is important to her then it is important to me. That I will go to the potlucks and will likely take over in the kitchen as I like to cook. I am fine with baptism as well as religious instruction of children. That I would under those circumstances be more supportive than a lot of theoretically Christian husbands I have known.
Not perfect obviously but I have heard of worse.
Cultural Christianity - the philosophy held by conservative atheists like yourself,
oooooh no. You have misinterpreted somewhere. Significantly.
Do me the courtesy of not referring to me as an atheist again, of any stripe. You can think what you like obviously but I see that as an insult and don't like it being claimed publicly. As it is inaccurate and paints a picture for others that is extremely far from the mark.
Richard Dawkins and others - is a short-term phenomenon that appears during the change from a Christian culture to a non-Christian culture.
You cannot hold onto it. It will disappear in a generation or two. It is simply nostalgia.
And when a "cultural christian" - an atheist who likes conservative culture - marries a Christian woman, because he is dominant in the marriage, the children will simply not end up holding those values strong enough to preserve the culture. It has to be grounded in genuine faith to be preserved for multiple generations, and most of those children will not have such a faith.
You are simply closer to the issue than me. Or perhaps from a different point of view is more accurate.
I see it in terms of collapse cycles. I am looking at it on a longer time scale and not for one religion or culture.
Collapse of faith is one of the early harbingers of collapse. Long list of factors but collapse of faith is always leading the charge.
In a broader sense, what you are describing is a group loosing its asabiyyah (pronounced ah-sab-ee-yah). It is a concept of social solidarity with an emphasis on unity, group consciousness, a sense of shared purpose and social cohesion. Used in the context of tribalism and clanism.
This is very much my meat and potatoes. Not the fodder of culturally Christian atheists. I will put my sense of asabiyyah against anyone's.
Christians are the "salt of the world", the ones that preserve it.
Keep in mind that you brought this up and that I would not have broached it otherwise. Also thst it is not a shot at Christians.
I am seeing in broad terms the opposite. I see the Christian faith being weaponized against them in the form of tolerance and shaming by way of manipulation and inculcation with maladsptive and frankly suicidal ideas.. It is being used to extremely good effect by non Christians and people who to my mind are falsely claiming the faith to tear Christianity down...well, the entire civilized world in a massive power grab.
Can be far more specific but I will leave that for the tinfoil hat thread where we can pound on that sort of issue
The only way to preserve the culture that you value is for those few rare conservative Christian women to marry conservative Christian men and raise children who have the same faith.
I know those women are incredibly attractive to anybody. I can completely understand why you want one, or more than one - they're awesome.
Still assuming that it is an explicit search for conservative Christian woman and I don't believe I have ever said anything of the sort. Not adverse to it obviously as I mentiond. And certainly not why I am on the site. I am here as I have expressed on occasion, for conversation about polygamy. The nuts and bolts, the proverbial origin story where people figured out that it might be the right path for people walk or sometimes smirking and keeping my peace when I see overt grifts with respect to motives.
I am also here for fellowship with other people who I have a good number of intersection points even if I am walking
Your thesis seems to be based on a bunch of inaccurate assumptions. I get how they could come about. My simple presence here and having no issue with being the odd man out to start. I would argue however that if my explicit goal were to wrangle myself a conservative Christian woman, it would not be difficult for me to do a refresher on scripture and then simply pretend. I don't do anything of the sort even though showing a false face to one's partner is depressingly common. That is not my style or goals in the slightest. Just like finding explicitly a conservative Christian woman is not my goal.
I will tell you my goals so as to make sure there is no potential for misunderstanding.
I would like to find a good conservative woman who is looney enough to fall for me and smart enough to see the advantages of polygamy as well as the simple fact that it is how humanity has functioned for most of it's existence. A woman who can be best pals with my wife, who is enthusiastic about being a mom and who has the patience of Job as I am aware of how much of a trial I can be at times. Ideally one with a strong faith and willing to get on board with my plans for the family.
That is about it. My list of disqualifying features is vastly longer than my want list.
ut they are not just there to be enjoyed by one man, they have a crucially important job to preserve a society for all men. And this is why Christians have always been careful to try and marry their daughters off to other believers.
Not a Christian thing...that is an every faith thing under ideal circumstances. Well, the Abrahamic ones at minim
That is how the culture you love was preserved for centuries, and it is the only way to preserve it for the future. There have always been some Christian women married off to other men - even Muhammad married one I believe (which explains much of the Christian flavour of the Quran). But the majority must marry Christians in order to sustain the culture, and as they become rarer this becomes more crucial by the year.
I feel like the Pope sitting patiently in a pew while the choir takes it in turn to tell me about the trinity.
that is not ragging on you. That is me saying that you are trying to give me a lecture that I already pound on...sometimes in this environment. Maybe you have not seen those times,, I haven't read every post of yours so I presume it is something along those lines.
You can rest assured however that I understand the concept.
I would think that almost everyone who is not deluded by leftist inculcation and blinded by close exposure to gaslight understood these pretty basic notions so I am mildly surprised to be given the lesson.
If you want a Christian wife, find Christ first. .
More assumptions and no..
I will take well meaning advice phrased as a recommendation given in good faith. I don't accept any dictate pharsed as an order however... not from any man, ever.
We all have our issues that get our back up and this is one of mine.
I have a firm line with respect to courtesy and presuming to order another man steps beyond the boundaries of courtesy by my standards.
Then marry one and you can be part of the solution,
phrased ad if granting permission an an arbiter. Again, no..
y'all can obviously chat and decide I am too much of a nuisance and boot me from the site but that is about it. Up to y'all to determine if I am that much of a disrupting influence. I would not have thought so but points of view differ.
Regardless though, attempts to dictate to me will be met with a firm no. Just as I would expect you to do the same if I were to phase statements to you as an order.
rather than just someone who simply enjoys the fruits of a belief system that you do not share and are not yourself going to grow and spread.
Presenting me as if I am some sort of parasite when having made a bunch of inaccurate assumptions. I call that another swing and miss.
We've got our eyes on a much larger mission here than just our own private marriages.
Glad to hear it. What you are demonstrating however is how very little you know about my own mission and that you are couching by structure my own goals as purely selfish as opposed to having an interest in the group as a whole.
As I mentioned earlier...I am not here fishing for wives. I am not opposed to meeting someone naturally...if I was however here expressly for trying to find a wife (on a non dating site)...as opposed to having sent several single woman to the site in hopes that they find their family...one might think the criticism and attempt at lessons more appropriate in trying to put woman off the idea of finding my attentions...which have not been directed at any woman here..than trying to actually explain ideas or concepts to me. Or perhaps just a warning off.
Neither of which to my mind is merited.
Post script
I did a quick scan and found several typographical errors or word substitutions from poor parsing of voice to text but I suspect many were missed. It was a long and broken reply and I am far from perfect even if it is something as basic as proofreading
