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Who Is Leading the Flock

lutherangirl

lutherangirl

Member
Real Person
Female
I want to start off by saying that it took me five months of viewing this site before posting anything, so these questions I'm about to ask is not to be against the polygamy lifestyle. I'm just the type of person that needs as much information as possible to know what side of the fence I stand on before I put trust in something.

Okay with that said here comes the questions, if polgamy was legal and there were churches all over the world that accepted this lifestyle, who would be the Pastor? Wouldn't he have to be a man married to one wife or not married? I ask this question, because 1 Timothy 3:1-3 states that "overseers and deacons need to be the husband of but one wife..." Paul mentions (I forgot the text) that it is better for a man not to marry, so he can focus totally on the Lord's work. I would imagine anyone who has more than one wife has a bigger job focusing on the needs of his family and leading a flock more than a man with only one wife.

Once again, I'm not trying to ruffle anybody's feathers just curious, and I know this group will give me faith-based Godly answers.

In Christ's Love,

Michelle
 
Typically there are two ways about this. First giving the translation the benefit of the doubt and requiring a pastor has one and only one wife. This would be for reason of time and focus that you already mentioned. Second is taking the raw text as meaning at least one wife, this is admissible because the base articles aren't specific. The passage may be rendered "The husband of a wife (non specific, non limiting)" as well as it may be rendered "The husband of one wife (specifically one)". Both interpretations have considerable history and come from as far back as the early church so the interpretation 'husband of a wife' isn't just a new to polygamy alteration. It can be conclusively noted that there where early churches that had polygamist pastors as Tretullian addressed them specifically.

I cannot see there being any way to mix this passage that allows unmarried individuals to be pastors, while the tradition of celibacy of priesthood ran deep I cannot see a way it is anything more than an affront to scripture. I don't mind the view that polygamists should not be pastors, I think that polygamists should be family and child raising focused people and can't imagine that many would want to be. To my knowledge the 'a' view is also perfectly admissible, so I respect polygamist pastors in the fullest. I suppose a problem arises when the people with the two views meet, in which case I personally would side with the poly pastor.



That's the short answer, I'm sure quite a few here can give you the in depth of how the words work and why the 'a' translation is reasonable.
 
I personally have no issue with the interpretation of 'a' or 'first' wife. It lines up with the rest of scripture, whereas 'one' does not. I do have an issue with the idea that a 'pastor' would lead this theoretical church. Christ is the leader of my church and the foundation is built on the apostles and prophets. That is why the Christian church is so out of order and the concept of polygyny is such a touchy subject. People not only do not know the Word, they more importantly do not know God or how He operates. I find it a sad state of affairs and it will take much tribulation for stubbornly rebellious, self-centered 'Christians' around the world to wake up and smell the coffee. This thing is for real and is of God. Isaiah chapter four will therefore come to pass just as all the scriptures cannot be broken. One must choose a side, because God does not choose for us. We are either with God or against Him. There is no middle ground. That is why He is about to shake heaven and earth, so that those on the fence will fall to one side or another. Either allow God to break you on the stone or the stone will fall on you and grind you into powder. Either way, God will have His way. We cannot dictate, we can only decide to be obedient to the whole Word or not. The time of Burger King Christianity is coming to an end. You can no longer have it your way. It is either God's way or the highway. Those who chose to decline now will be forced to fulfill Isaiah 4:1 in the near future. Those who willing accept this 'new thing' and become perfected or mature in Christ may possibly be spared much grief. This church WILL soon exist and Christ will lead this obedient flock, (Ezekiel chapter 34).

Isaiah 4:1 -

4 In that day few men will be left alive. Seven women will fight over each of them and say, "Let us all marry you! We will provide our own food and clothing. Only let us be called by your name so we won/t be mocked as old maids."

Isaiah 43:16-19 -

16 I am the LORD, who opened a way through the waters, making a dry path through the sea. 17 I called forth the mighty army of Egypt with all its chariots and horses. I drew them beneath the waves, and they drowned, their lives snuffed out like a smoldering candlewick.

18 But forget all that, it is nothing compared to what I am going to do. 19 For I am about to do a brand-new thing. See, I have already begun! Do you not see it? I will make a pathway through the wilderness for my people to come home. I will create rivers for them in the desert!

Deuteronomy 30:15-20 -

15"See, I have set before you today life and good, death and evil, 16in that I command you today to love the LORD your God, to walk in His ways, and to keep His commandments, His statutes, and His judgments, that you may live and multiply; and the LORD your God will bless you in the land which you go to possess. 17But if your heart turns away so that you do not hear, and are drawn away, and worship other gods and serve them, 18I announce to you today that you shall surely perish; you shall not prolong your days in the land which you cross over the Jordan to go in and possess. 19I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live; 20that you may love the LORD your God, that you may obey His voice, and that you may cling to Him, for He is your life and the length of your days; and that you may dwell in the land which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them."

Matthew 21:43-44 -

43"Therefore I say to you, the kingdom of God will be taken from you and given to a nation bearing the fruits of it. 44"And whoever falls on this stone will be broken; but on whomever it falls, it will grind him to powder."

Ephesians 2:19-22 -

19Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, 20having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone, 21in whom the whole building, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord, 22in whom you also are being built together for a dwelling place of God in the Spirit.

Be blessed,

Dr. Ray
 
My opinion is that the "mia" which can be translated "a", "first", or "one" should be translated as "first".

Mathew 28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first [day] of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre. The "mia" here is translated "first".

Having "a" wife implies that someone with a wife is more capable to lead than someone without a wife. That does not seem valid and with this interpretation an elder or deacon who has a wife die (monogamous) would have to give up his positon.

The whole qualification here is that if a man has taken a second or third, then the first should still be with him. This shows that he not only has not divorced or released her by having a hard heart, but also that he handles his home in such a way that the first feels safe, loved, and is content to remain even after he has taken another.

It just works better if translated "first". For instance a leader who takes a plural lady while leading and does not lead his home in such a way that his first remains, may have a lack of leadership capability. And as this man steps down from leadership, the problems are in his home and not the whole church.

I know this gives a lot of emphasis in the actions of the first. But it is a good filter to keep people that can not lead from acquiring a position and also keeps the unsubmissive first, who does not cooperate with her husbands actions, from causing problems for the whole church as the man steps down to protect the church.

So as I see it, the qualification does not even apply to monogomous or single or previously divorced people. The early church had plural people in it and having a qualification that applied to them is not remarkable.
 
I agree 100%

Well said. I did not know the darkness in my heart until I married my current wife and her light shined in my darkness. I have grown much in the Lord as a result of being married to my current wife, Melissa. We will celebrate 6 years on April, 12th. God Himself arranged our marriage, as we never went out on a date before we were married. Now that is faith!

Be blessed,

Dr. Ray
 
Okay with that said here comes the questions, if polgamy was legal and there were churches all over the world that accepted this lifestyle, who would be the Pastor?
Click to expand...

Let us just keep in mind that this is a separate issue. It has absolutely nothing to do with the question of whether or not it is appropriate for the Church to bind a man's family to only one wife.

It is wholly unrighteous and wicked for the self appointed Church clergy to step into the home and legislate to a man how many wives his family may have. This is not the Church's business and neither is it the State's.
 
...if polygamy was legal and there were churches all over the world that accepted this lifestyle, who would be the Pastor?
Click to expand...

I guess I honestly don't see the conflict, Dr. Ray. Admittedly, perhaps that is because -- at least so far as "deacons" or "overseers" are concerned -- I tend to accept the "first wife" reading of the passage in question as well, meaning that said position should be filled by a man who has been, and REMAINS, married to the 'wife of his youth', regardless of how he may have been further blessed since.

With the exception of that issue, it simply doesn't appear that "pastor" implies such a limit. Moses had at least one wife, and had to learn to delegate responsibility anyway. What's coming is going to be a challenge. Even though Isaiah 4:1 points toward a time of blessing which perhaps follows the darkest of such intermediate days, I suspect that many of us sense the need for patriarchal leadership which is now on the horizon.

Blessings,
Mark
 
Mark,

I am not sure what you are referring to with the word conflict. What I am saying about pastors is that they should not be the main leaders of the church worldwide. Apostles and prophets should be laying the fooundation and with Christ as the chief cornerstone, regardless of the number of wives the leaders have. The modern church is out of order with regards to the thinking that pastors should be running the church. That is not the order of God and will change soon.

Be blessed,

Ray
 
I meant that I wasn't sure about the question, Dr. Ray, because I didn't see that there was any conflict in interpretation. That is true with respect to your last comment as well.

And I agree, if there IS any conflict, it is between the "Church" and the Word. It is not only their 'pastors' who have "failed to teach" the difference between the set-apart and the profane...


Blessings,

Mark
 
Thanks to all who educated me regarding these questions I had. I want everyone to know that I believe God is the cornerstone of the Church, but He does appoint men to lead it. I mean he appointed twelve "ordinary" men as His apostles that whom, even after spending three years with Jesus, weren't "perfect or mature" (I'm addressing Dr. Ray on this :D ) in their faith. Knowing that even these men that He appointed had many faults makes me feel as stupid for digging for the Truth.

BTW, does anyone know if any of the twelve apostles practiced polygamy?

Michelle
 
M,

The reason that the twelve apostles were not 'perfect' after spending time with Jesus is that they had not yet received the baptism of the Holy Spirit, (see Acts chapters 1-2). They did not have the power to change until they had received the Spirit in fullness. This is exactly what I am talking about in that the church at large neither understands the path to perfection, nor teaches it. Jesus established it, the apostles confirmed it and I believe that at least one, (John) fulfilled it. However, the path to perfection in Christ is a Word for those of us who will hear it in these end-times, because this too is part of God's plan that the church leaders do not understand. If the church up to this time had truly understood this principle, then the scriptures and God's timing would not have been fulfilled according to His plan, but this too requires spiritual visual acquity to comprehend. Denying that perfection in Christ IS the thing that we should aspire to is the lazy man's approach to Christianity and the wide path that most Christians CHOOSE to take. This attitude makes it easier to live comfortably with one's faults, rather than setting out to change by the grace or power of God. This is also why most Christians live their lives in defeat, rather than the victory that Jesus suffered and died for us to have. If one denies that God wants us to become perfected or mature in Christ, then it is a non-issuse in that person's mind. However, denial makes it no less the truth than does denying any other aspect of God or His great plan. This denial simply serves to confirm the scriptures about the spiritual blindness and stubbornness of God's people, as they carry on rejecting the full truth of the Word so that they can remain comfortable with their error. If you really want to know how this thing works, then you can go to my web site at http://www.perfectchristian.110mb.com/teachings.htm and download the teaching entitled, 'The Rules to the Game of Life'. This teaching outlines the pattern that the Lord laid down for us and that ALL the apostles confirmed. God summarized the error of His people's ways in Hosea chapter 4. Nothing much is different today in the Christian church. They want to believe that everything will be okay if they just carry on as they are doing. I am here to tell you it is NOT going to be okay for those who reject this message.

Hosea Chapter 4 -

Chapter 4


1 Hear the word of the Lord,
You children of Israel,
For the Lord brings a charge against the inhabitants of the land:
“There is no truth or mercy
Or knowledge of God in the land.
2 By swearing and lying,
Killing and stealing and committing adultery,
They break all restraint,
With bloodshed upon bloodshed.
3 Therefore the land will mourn;
And everyone who dwells there will waste away
With the beasts of the field
And the birds of the air;
Even the fish of the sea will be taken away.
4 “Now let no man contend, or rebuke another;
For your people are like those who contend with the priest.
5 Therefore you shall stumble in the day;
The prophet also shall stumble with you in the night;
And I will destroy your mother.
6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge.
Because you have rejected knowledge,
I also will reject you from being priest for Me;
Because you have forgotten the law of your God,
I also will forget your children.
7 “The more they increased,
The more they sinned against Me;
I will change their glory into shame.
8 They eat up the sin of My people;
They set their heart on their iniquity.
9 And it shall be: like people, like priest.
So I will punish them for their ways,
And reward them for their deeds.
10 For they shall eat, but not have enough;
They shall commit harlotry, but not increase;
Because they have ceased obeying the Lord.
11 “Harlotry, wine, and new wine enslave the heart.
12 My people ask counsel from their wooden idols,
And their staff informs them.
For the spirit of harlotry has caused them to stray,
And they have played the harlot against their God.
13 They offer sacrifices on the mountaintops,
And burn incense on the hills,
Under oaks, poplars, and terebinths,
Because their shade is good.
Therefore your daughters commit harlotry,
And your brides commit adultery.
14 “I will not punish your daughters when they commit harlotry,
Nor your brides when they commit adultery;
For the men themselves go apart with harlots,
And offer sacrifices with a ritual harlot.
Therefore people who do not understand will be trampled.
15 “Though you, Israel, play the harlot,
Let not Judah offend.
Do not come up to Gilgal,
Nor go up to Beth Aven,
Nor swear an oath, saying, ‘As the Lord lives’—
16 “For Israel is stubborn
Like a stubborn calf;
Now the Lord will let them forage
Like a lamb in open country.
17 “Ephraim is joined to idols,
Let him alone.
18 Their drink is rebellion,
They commit harlotry continually.
Her rulers dearly love dishonor.
19 The wind has wrapped her up in its wings,
And they shall be ashamed because of their sacrifices.

The Holy Bible, New King James Version, (Nashville, Tennessee: Thomas Nelson, Inc.) 1982.

Thanks,

Dr. Ray
 
I do not know of any indication that any of the 12 practiced plural or did not practice it. However, it can be established that Judaism during this time practiced plural. If there is a desire to behave in the same manner as the early church, then who was in the early church? The early church contained those converted from Judaism. Since the law specifically allowed it and since it was common in Judaism at this time, there are now practicing Jewish converts. Since it was not sin, it was not an issue for the early church. The modern church wants an early church that validates the fallacious notion that Christ somehow manages to make plural a sin without making many of the patriarchal characters in the Old Testament into sinners. Basically, the modern church wants to come up with a way to love David, Abraham, and many of the characters of the Old Testament without lumping them in with modern Christians, which they seem to not want to love. Christ and the early church were not a sinner on/off switch for modern convenience. If someone really wants to follow scripture, love the Old Testament characters, and follow Christ and wants to emulate the early church, then one must admit the truth. The modern church is just wrong in calling plural a sin.
 
Dr. Ray,

Thanks to the link to your site. I guess I've been Lutheran my whole life. I tune into Joyce Meyer and have read some of her books, but I don't know where to worship that isn't what most on this site consider "mainstream" or your quote "Burger King Christianity". I told you before that my husband isn't really on board yet with the whole religion thing, so my options are very limited. He already thinks I'm a "Bible Thumper", so if I have to be careful not to constantly be talking to him about religion.

Thanks again, for your great advice.

In Christian Love,

Michelle
 
Welltan,

Thank you for your information about the apostles. I just finished reading a book about them. It does give reference to some Bible passages that talked about a few wives of the apostles but doesn't say anything about polygamy. Have you ever read anything written by Josephus? I know he wrote about many accounts that aren't in the Bible?

Michelle
 
I have never read Josephus. However, the idea is a good one. Your suggestion and the following which I found on the internet may motivate me to study in that area.

Some examples of plural during the time of Jesus and the apostles, examples the early Christians would have been familiar with, were Herod Archelaus, Herod Antipas, and Caiaphas. Though some Jews opposed it, Josephus, a contemporary of the apostles, wrote that "it is the ancient practice among us to have many wives at the same time" (Antiquities Of The Jews, 17:1:2).
 
M,

The mainstream church is really out of order overall. God will bring order, but it is going to take some convincing. That convincing is going to come through tribulation. In fact the great tribulation is primarily for the church. Most mainstream church leaders who teach about the book of Revelation and the great tribulation teach that Christians will be 'raptured' out of the earth BEFORE the great tribulation. I teach that this is one of the greatest lies perpetrated within the Christian church in its modern history. Probably teaching that polygamy is a sin is second. The church leaders as a whole do not subscribe to the concept that Christians will suffer. However, it is through suffering that we become perfected in obedience to God. This was the case even for Jesus. Consider the following scriptures as a sample of this concept...

Hebrews 2:9-10 -

9But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, for the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, that He, by the grace of God, might taste death for everyone.

10For it was fitting for Him, for whom are all things and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons to glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

(The Holy Bible, New King James Version, (Nashville, Tennessee: Thomas Nelson, Inc.) 1982.

Hebrews 5:5-14 -

5So also Christ did not glorify Himself to become High Priest, but it was He who said to Him:

You are My Son,
Today I have begotten You.

6As He also says in another place:

You are a priest forever
According to the order of Melchizedek;

7who, in the days of His flesh, when He had offered up prayers and supplications, with vehement cries and tears to Him who was able to save Him from death, and was heard because of His godly fear, 8though He was a Son, yet He learned obedience by the things which He suffered. 9And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him, 10called by God as High Priest “according to the order of Melchizedek, 11of whom we have much to say, and hard to explain, since you have become dull of hearing.

12For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food. 13For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe. 14But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

(The Holy Bible, New King James Version, (Nashville, Tennessee: Thomas Nelson, Inc.) 1982.

I Peter 2:18-25 -

18Servants, be submissive to your masters with all fear, not only to the good and gentle, but also to the harsh. 19For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully. 20For what credit is it if, when you are beaten for your faults, you take it patiently? But when you do good and suffer, if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God. 21For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:

22 Who committed no sin,
Nor was deceit found in His mouth;

23who, when He was reviled, did not revile in return; when He suffered, He did not threaten, but committed Himself to Him who judges righteously; 24who Himself bore our sins in His own body on the tree, that we, having died to sins, might live for righteousness by whose stripes you were healed. 25For you were like sheep going astray, but have now returned to the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls.

(The Holy Bible, New King James Version, (Nashville, Tennessee: Thomas Nelson, Inc.) 1982.

It is our calling to suffer for doing the right thing. We will also suffer for doing the wrong thing, but we do NOT get extra credit from God for that suffering. However, both types of suffering will do us good in the end. The reason we suffer for doing the wrong thing is to lead us back to God, just like we punish our children when they are out of order, because we love them. Obedience is the end result, (thus my teaching, 'SUFFERING - The Key to Obedience'). Suffering for doing the right thing is so that we will understand what it feels like to be hated without a cause. That way we will be less likely to go against God like Lucifer did and God will know He can trust us with eternal life. These things and others are basic Christian concepts, but are NOT taught in the mainstream church. This is not a new issue to the church, which is why the writer of Hebrews said what he/she did in 5:12-14 above. It is only through understanding the basics of Christianity along with the deeper issues that God has revealed to people like me that we can move into perfection in Christ and Jesus will come back. The great tribulation will help in this regard. It will serve to show people that they are indeed out of order and those who truly want to follow Christ will become perfected through the persecution that they will suffer during the great tribulation. Those who heed the warning that God is speaking through people like me may well be able to escape the entire tribulation, but most reject this word, because they think it is not mainstream, so it cannot be true. However, it is true and it WILL happen this way. I am here to try to convince people in advance to avoid the trouble that lies just ahead, (see my teaching by the same name). The only way to do so is to become perfected in Christ BEFORE the great tribulation. However, one must believe this concept before steps can be taken to actually move in that direction. Whether or not one's spouse chooses to comply with the Word should not make any difference if one wishes to escape this upcoming trouble. The one world order was established at the G-20 yesterday. These things are happening quickly and time is short. It is one of my jobs to speak these truths, including the scriptures about end-time polygyny spoken of in Isaiah chapter 4. It speaks of those who will escape these things.

The pattern of moving the church into perfection in Christ was described by the apostles.

Hebrews 6:1-8 -

1Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. 3And this we will do if God permits. 4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame. 7For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8but if it bears thorns and briars, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.

(The Holy Bible, New King James Version, (Nashville, Tennessee: Thomas Nelson, Inc.) 1982.

Ephesians 4:7-16 -

7But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ's gift. 8Therefore He says:

When He ascended on high,
He led captivity captive,
And gave gifts to men.

9(Now this, He ascended, what does it mean but that He also first descended into the lower parts of the earth? 10He who descended is also the One who ascended far above all the heavens, that He might fill all things.) 11And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; 14that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, 15but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head Christ 16from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love.

(The Holy Bible, New King James Version, (Nashville, Tennessee: Thomas Nelson, Inc.) 1982.

Most people cannot even tell you what the 6 foundational doctrines of Christianity listed in Hebrews 6:1-2 above are, let alone understand or receive the concept of operating in their given ministry gift(s), so that they can come the place of perfection in Christ. The five-fold ministry gifts were given to us in order that the church could grow up and become perfected in Christ. This is how the second coming will happen and not a minute before. I have privately explained what your gift is and what you need to do to begin to operate in that gift. Most reject this type of information, again because it comes from someone untrained by the mainstream church and it may not be convenient for them. Whatever the thinly veiled excuse is, this is the reason that people who reject these truths will needlessly have to suffer the great tribulation and even the beginning of these tribulations that we are already incurring. I would remind you that the men that Jesus chose to bring the New Covenant into the church of the day, (with the exception of Paul and he had to be struck blind in order for him to get this stuff and to gain spiritual eyesight) were also untrained. However like me, the early church leaders had a more important characteristic, WILLINGNESS to obey no matter the cost. I do not really care whether or not people believe me. God said it and it is true. Therefore, there will be enough people somewhere who will, because the scriptures need to be fulfilled. Thus, all those who reject this message will be replaced by some who will. All the tools necessary to become perfected in Christ, God has made freely available from the book and teachings on the web site He had me build. I also make myself freely available to anyone who wishes to learn these things, in order to help them get busy doing what God put them here to do. Anything other than operating in our gifting(s) and doing what God put us here to do will NOT bring glory to God, (see my teaching, How Do We Glorify God? and John 17:4). These things are true and God has confirmed them on many occasions through healings and other miracles, just as He confirmed the work of Jesus and the apostles, (Mark 16:14-20). There is at least one person on this site who can attest to this, as he has received a healing. Though he still thinks I have the gift of healing, (which I do not) he was indeed healed through believing and DOING what I showed Him about the truth about healing, (see my teaching by the same name). Many have looked at this stuff, but few have comprehended it, just as most of those who live in darkness cannot comprehend the light, (John 1:5). Maybe you will change your mind. I hope so. If you do, I am here to help. Joyce Meyer is a good place to start, but one needs to go beyond what she teaches in order to prepare properly for the upcoming trouble, because she also teaches the false concept of the pre-trib rapture.

Be blessed,

Ray
 
Dr. Ray,

I spent a few days going over your teachings on your website. You truly do have the gift to teach. "The Potter made me pretty common", so I have to read things over again to grasp the message.

I don't really know what talent God has given me, but I do think I need to figure it out to "mature" into my faith. I think just recognizing that my church is falling short for my spiritual growth is a step in the right direction. Through prayer I'm sure God will lead me to where and what I need to be doing.

Thanks for not giving up on me yet.

In Christ,
Michelle
 
Michelle,

We are all just lumps of clay. It is only through abiding in Christ and by God's grace, (which is His power through the Holy Spirit) that any of us can do anything, (Psalm 84:11, Prov. 3:34, John 15:5 and others). The enemy wants you to think that you cannot do things, but wherever you are weak is where God can be strong, (II Cor.12:9). Usually the area that our gift is in will be one of our weaknesses in the natural, so that we can never take credit for what we do for God. I have such poor reading skills that they told me I would never get through Medical School. Instead, I graduated with honors and received the Department of Surgery award for being the overall best student in surgery in my graduating class. To that date, I scored the highest mark that had ever been recorded on the nationalized surgery final exam. From a small medical school in Columbia, MO I was accepted into the number one surgical training program in the world at The Johns Hopkins Hospital. Through God's grace, all this was done in spite of people all around me telling me I could not do it, even though I was not really walking where I should have been with Christ at the time. I was a prodigal, but I was still His son and He got me through it. I have finally come to where God wants me to be and am still by His grace doing things that people tell me I cannot do.

You too can be a success story for God. All you have to do is make the decision, put your forehead like flint in the right direction, rejoice in the midst of the storm, pray and give thanks to God and He will do the rest. I am here to help. One of my jobs is to identify the ministry gifts in God's people and help them get busy doing what God sent them here to do. You are an apostolic prophet, just like your namesake. I can help you learn to operate in these gifts, but you need to receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit to be able to truly understand and do these things. Most of God's people around the world have no clue about these things. The church leaders do not know these things and God is taking untrained people like you and I and putting His Spirit to work in them as never before. The only thing we have to do is believe and obey. This is faith and love.

Be blessed,

Ray
 
Dr. Ray,

That is incredible all that you have accomplished in your career! It's no wonder that you feel truly blessed. Thanks for giving me advice about gifts and talents. My success story will be if I can trust God enough to do what I'm suppose to do without indulging in too much Lutheran pop :D (beer--for you non-Lutheran folks) when the going gets tough.

Michelle
 
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