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How best to promote patriarchy and polygyny

B

Bartato

Seasoned Member
Male
I'm considering how we should best promote understanding of patriarchy and polygyny among our friends, families, pastors, churches, and society.

People tend to use two different approaches of persuasion.

There is the rhetorical approach, which primarily relies on feelings, and emotional manipulation.

There is also the dialectical approach, which relies primarily on logic, solid evidence, and sound reasoning.

I tend towards the dialectical approach. Christians in general tend that way, as our faith is based on certain truth claims. Christians also usually view the rhetorical approach as dishonest (it can be). Men tend to use the dialectical approach more than women.

The media establishment and politicians use emotional manipulation almost exclusively.

Overall, I think the rhetorical approach of emotional manipulation tends to be more effective, as most people (women even moreso than men) really tend to be controlled more by emotion than by reason. Modern and postmodern people especially operate that way.

Those of us that have studied the relevant Scriptures understand very clearly that the Bible teaches patriarchy, and allows men to have multiple wives.

We take this Biblical evidence and lay it out in a clear, logical, and well reasoned manner. We then present it to our wives, pastors, and others.

A few are able to think critically, and will submit themselves to the truth of the Bible.

Most just can't accept it, no matter how much evidence is presented. They might rationally comprehend it, but cannot emotionally accept the truth. This is such an emotionally charged issue that many people freak out, or shut down.

I think we have to continue the dialectic reasoning,. but also supplement extensively with emotionally effective arguments. We still have to be truthful, but also need to learn to use the tools of rhetoric.

I'm not good at it.
I'm really not.
I bet most of you aren't either.

Memes are one effective tool of rhetoric. The right meme can powerfully express a given truth in an emotionally effective way. Music and poetry can also be used very effectively.

People need to not only understand patriarchy and polygyny as logical conclusions, but also feel that they can be good, and beautiful as well.

What do you think? Should we strive in that manner? How can we improve?
 
Over on our memes page, I've been trying to develop my skills of rhetoric. It is clear that some of our memes are more emotionally powerful and resonate more with our hearts and guts. These tools really are powerful.
 
Bartato said:
What do you think?
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I predominantly rely on regular witnessing with no attempt at persuasion. The result is typically that people beg me to tell them more.
 
Don't promote patriarchy. For most people first associations are negative. Why swim upstream whrn you can swim downstream?

Promote results of patriarchy like successful marriage. Teach people good techniques like man making final decision. Let people taste good fruit before explaining theory.
 
MemeFan said:
Don't promote patriarchy. For most people first associations are negative. Why swim upstream whrn you can swim downstream?

Promote results of patriarchy like successful marriage. Teach people good techniques like man making final decision. Let people taste good fruit before explaining theory.
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So basically teach patriarchy without using that terminology. 😉
That makes quite a bit of sense, as the word has a very negative association for most people.
 
Bartato said:
So basically teach patriarchy without using that terminology. 😉
That makes quite a bit of sense, as the word has a very negative association for most people.
Click to expand...
I don't see reason to hide terminology. But no need to lead with terminology.

I would explain stuff after ending course when people have more good experience or just explain what to do without going into why.

Don't hide from curious because that makes you dishonest.
 
 
Bartato said:
I'm considering how we should best promote understanding of patriarchy and polygyny among our friends, families, pastors, churches, and society.

People tend to use two different approaches of persuasion.

There is the rhetorical approach, which primarily relies on feelings, and emotional manipulation.

There is also the dialectical approach, which relies primarily on logic, solid evidence, and sound reasoning.

I tend towards the dialectical approach. Christians in general tend that way, as our faith is based on certain truth claims. Christians also usually view the rhetorical approach as dishonest (it can be). Men tend to use the dialectical approach more than women.

The media establishment and politicians use emotional manipulation almost exclusively.

Overall, I think the rhetorical approach of emotional manipulation tends to be more effective, as most people (women even moreso than men) really tend to be controlled more by emotion than by reason. Modern and postmodern people especially operate that way.

Those of us that have studied the relevant Scriptures understand very clearly that the Bible teaches patriarchy, and allows men to have multiple wives.

We take this Biblical evidence and lay it out in a clear, logical, and well reasoned manner. We then present it to our wives, pastors, and others.

A few are able to think critically, and will submit themselves to the truth of the Bible.

Most just can't accept it, no matter how much evidence is presented. They might rationally comprehend it, but cannot emotionally accept the truth. This is such an emotionally charged issue that many people freak out, or shut down.

I think we have to continue the dialectic reasoning,. but also supplement extensively with emotionally effective arguments. We still have to be truthful, but also need to learn to use the tools of rhetoric.

I'm not good at it.
I'm really not.
I bet most of you aren't either.

Memes are one effective tool of rhetoric. The right meme can powerfully express a given truth in an emotionally effective way. Music and poetry can also be used very effectively.

People need to not only understand patriarchy and polygyny as logical conclusions, but also feel that they can be good, and beautiful as well.

What do you think? Should we strive in that manner? How can we improve?
Click to expand...
I would really like to chat with you more about your practices. Please send me a response so we can connect. Thanks
 
A lot of meat in that video! Thanks.
 
I also think it's worthwhile to go to 2:55:22 in the following video, listen to Kevin Samuel's response to the man who asserts that something needs to be done in the culture to convince people that interracial marriage is OK before acting on it oneself, and while viewing translate it in one's mind over into the notion of what approach one should take in regard to implementing polygyny . . .


The whole video is well worth watching, but it's not generally relevant to the particular topic of this thread!
 
I think that the best approach is to first be walking in the Spirit so that the Spirit can guide you in how to best talk to each individual person. Unfortunately a lot of people don't respond well still but you have no idea what kind of seeds the Spirit used you to plant for later either. :)
 
Keith Martin said:
the man who asserts that something needs to be done in the culture to convince people that interracial marriage is OK before acting on it oneself
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Is this something that is still seen as wrong in the US? No one blinks an eye about it here. I watched a movie the other day where this married couple were saying how they'd had a rough time with family not accepting them being together because they should find someone 'the same as them'. I couldn't for the life of me work out why until later on in the movie when I realised he was black and she was white.
 
FollowingHim2 said:
Is this something that is still seen as wrong in the US? No one blinks an eye about it here. I watched a movie the other day where this married couple were saying how they'd had a rough time with family not accepting them being together because they should find someone 'the same as them'. I couldn't for the life of me work out why until later on in the movie when I realised he was black and she was white.
Click to expand...
These days, few white people remain who consider interracial dating to be inappropriate -- despite what is portrayed in movies -- but what Kevin Samuels is discussing in the video is something that remains very much a hot button issue within the American black subculture: black men being excoriated by black women for dating or marrying white women. It is generally successfully portrayed within the American black community as being an unforgiveable betrayal of black women for a black man to date outside his race, and what Kevin was challenging both black men and black women to confront is that this successful demonization of extra-racial relationships has led to black women entirely taking black men for granted, and in the process ceasing for the most part to prepare themselves to be decent wives for black men (the average black woman in America is now heavier than the average black man, despite being 5 inches shorter; she considers it a birthright to believe she should be treated like a queen no matter how disrespectful she is to men; etc.).

My point, though, was to assert that it's foolish to wait for the culture to declare polygyny legitimate before acting on engaging in it with women who indicate that they're ready. The parallel approach of those who know the truth about biblical polygamy if they were to follow in the footsteps of the degeneration of the black culture as chronicled by Samuels would be for men seeking plural families to (a) graciously accept being treated as deserving of utter disrespect, and (b) humbly expect to only have 2nd or 3rd wives who were at least 60 pounds overweight and treated them like dogs, with the opposite of willingness to be respectfully cooperative, instead hoping like an insane person that sometime down the line the culture would come around to declare polygyny righteous.

Knuckling under to disrespect and failure to exhibit proper self-care hasn't worked for black men, and I'm confident it's no more likely to work well for men seeking to establish plural families.
 
FollowingHim2 said:
Is this something that is still seen as wrong in the US? No one blinks an eye about it here. I watched a movie the other day where this married couple were saying how they'd had a rough time with family not accepting them being together because they should find someone 'the same as them'. I couldn't for the life of me work out why until later on in the movie when I realised he was black and she was white.
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Interracial relationships are quite common here and have been for several decades. They’re more common among the lower socio-economic strata but no one has batted an eye at them since the 80’s, or at least very few people have.
 
I find living my life with an answer of the hope inside helos quite a bit. You would be amazed how much it comes up in conversation when you are attentive to it. When I was explaining Gods structure if authority to my 10, and 9 year old boys they already understood it because they saw it. They thought it was weird when I told them that not every husband is in charge of his wife lol
 
The Revolting Man said:
Interracial relationships are quite common here and have been for several decades. They’re more common among the lower socio-economic strata but no one has batted an eye at them since the 80’s, or at least very few people have.
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It varies, I know some that are still very offended by it.
 
steve said:
It varies, I know some that are still very offended by it.
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Of course, but some is still a relatively small and nearly-powerless minority.
 
Keith Martin said:
Of course, but some is still a relatively small and nearly-powerless minority.
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Powerless on a national scale, but powerful in making people feel discriminated against.
 
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