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How to help men have chests.

D

DawoodSaar

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Real Person
Male
Howdy folks!

I've been mentoring a young man, aged 19, who just recently came to Christianity in the last few months. I've definitely given him a completely different trajectory than the mainstream already.

I've told him my story of going Hebrew-Roots-ish, how so much of Christian dogma is dogdoodoo, and presented significantly clearer views on about every major point of debate still ongoing in Christendom.

But one area I can't teach is that which I lack myself. How to be a stud! To gain that gravitas of masculinity. The likes of Jordan Peterson only take one so far, and information on scriptural approaches to work-ethic are rare. So, I open the floor to both manly sasquatches and and the cryptozoologists (ladies) who follow them; what manners maketh man?

(Not looking necessarily for debate, but more a list of best things to focus on for masculine development. Thanks!)
 
The ever unpopular idea that a real man is the provider for his family, and that the wife/wives exist to assist him in whatever mission he has in life.
So, backing up, he needs a mission before he needs his first mate.
 
IMHO the key to manhood is personal accomplishment and confidence.

As a man accomplishes more in life and becomes confident of himself the people around him see this and they recognize him as a man and perhaps even as a leader.

My first indication that someone is NOT a man is when they have to tell me that they're a man. See, unless they told me this I would have never known.
 
Their gender is male, becoming a man is an option.
 
Two sources that I appreciate from a reformed Christian perspective (recognize and avoid their lawless comments) are in preferred order:

https://www.ericconn.com/ Some really good articles, some GREAT podcasts... Chew the meat...

https://itsgoodtobeaman.com/ Besides the blog and a good book (until chapter 8, as I recall) by the same name, they have a weekly newsletter that I have been repeatedly removed from. (Actually, that is a suspicion, but I have signed up multiple times and then will receive it a few weeks before mysteriously being 'dropped.' Might be because I was critical of their monogamy only position... :D )
 
steve said:
The ever unpopular idea that a real man is the provider for his family, and that the wife/wives exist to assist him in whatever mission he has in life.
So, backing up, he needs a mission before he needs his first mate.
Click to expand...
This!!!!

I need a Tshirt... No Mission, No Woman, Know Mission, Know Woman!! (You'll see that in my Zazzle store before sundown.. LOL!!)
 
Everyone sees what happens to a young man between pre-military service and post training. When he has learned "how" to take life, he develops the immediate confidence to protect said life. (note I'm saying confidence, not wisdom)

IMHO, the quickest thing a young man can do to gain that confidence is to get the training in how to be a warrior. To become physically strong and capable will by natural course impart the deep conviction that he actually is capable. When he internalizes that understanding, he becomes confident. Of course a man can get to the same degree of confidence other ways, but speaking as a father of sons. They are being trained in how to be warriors. It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener in a war. They will be trained to be confident around members of the opposite sex. That word train is important, it means exposure to the hazards, and consistent drills and working out of the means and methods needed to control, mitigate, and navigate the hazards.

The confidence to engage and push through obstacles in life depends on mindset. You develop that mindset over time and exposure.

DO HARD THINGS. Get knocked down physically and mentally, and practice getting back up again, KNOWING you're about to get knocked down AGAIN.

Train for a half ironman competition. Build muscle, train with weapons, learn a topic and debate it, accomplish something.

A weak mommas boy who's full of fear and self loathing will lash out and attack when confronted. A confident warrior of a man will smile and walk away calmly because he knows 4 ways to end the life of the person pushing the conflict. Women pick up on that body language extremely well. That kind of confidence and self assurance is not something that can be faked or acquired any other way.
 
PeteR said:
This!!!!

I need a Tshirt... No Mission, No Woman, Know Mission, Know Woman!! (You'll see that in my Zazzle store before sundown.. LOL!!)
Click to expand...
Great, except Women don’t need to singular. 😁
 
The consensus so far seems to be that the core of masculinity is missional. I agree wholeheartedly!

How might one discover/be assisted in the discovery of their particular mission as a man? Because unlike the military where orders are directly given by one in authority, most men's vocation/mission is not explicitly given, either verbally or by written order. It is this lack of direction that is so unappealing in a man, but is also seemingly external to himself. Unless "taking dominion over the earth" is enough direction to work from for most?
 
DawoodSaar said:
Howdy folks!

I've been mentoring a young man, aged 19, who just recently came to Christianity in the last few months. I've definitely given him a completely different trajectory than the mainstream already.

I've told him my story of going Hebrew-Roots-ish, how so much of Christian dogma is dogdoodoo, and presented significantly clearer views on about every major point of debate still ongoing in Christendom.

But one area I can't teach is that which I lack myself. How to be a stud! To gain that gravitas of masculinity. The likes of Jordan Peterson only take one so far, and information on scriptural approaches to work-ethic are rare. So, I open the floor to both manly sasquatches and and the cryptozoologists (ladies) who follow them; what manners maketh man?

(Not looking necessarily for debate, but more a list of best things to focus on for masculine development. Thanks!)
Click to expand...
Regarding work/employment our responsibility is quite clearly laid out in Scripture. Eph. 6:6-7 not with eyeservice, as men-pleasers, but as bondservants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart, with goodwill doing service, as to the Lord, and not to men. Col.3:23-24 And whatever you do, do it heartily, as to the Lord and not to men, knowing that from the Lord you will receive the reward of the inheritance; for you serve the Lord Christ.

Teach him to work hard and work faithfully at whatever responsibilities God has given him. Be a man of God, not just a man of the world trying to be attractive to women of this world.

My $0.02 worth.
 
DawoodSaar said:
The consensus so far seems to be that the core of masculinity is missional. I agree wholeheartedly!

How might one discover/be assisted in the discovery of their particular mission as a man? Because unlike the military where orders are directly given by one in authority, most men's vocation/mission is not explicitly given, either verbally or by written order. It is this lack of direction that is so unappealing in a man, but is also seemingly external to himself. Unless "taking dominion over the earth" is enough direction to work from for most?
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Agreed w @frederick but I would add that Yah can provide specific guidance. My eldest was torn on career field choice. We told him to pray about it. A few days later he said, 'God told me what to do... you know how i'm a germophobe? Well, He told me to become a nurse.' We agreed, based on the odd direction change and son's dislike of most things 'icky' that is was Yah's direction.

Fast forward five years and he is a nurse practitioner and loves, loves, loves what he does. Perfect fit. And, Yah is showing him how he is to benefit the Kingdom. Further, as his mission is honed, he is preparing to lead a family.

So, generally, be about the King's business. Specifically, seek Him and what path He would guide you into.
 
DawoodSaar said:
Howdy folks!

I've been mentoring a young man, aged 19, who just recently came to Christianity in the last few months. I've definitely given him a completely different trajectory than the mainstream already.

I've told him my story of going Hebrew-Roots-ish, how so much of Christian dogma is dogdoodoo, and presented significantly clearer views on about every major point of debate still ongoing in Christendom.

But one area I can't teach is that which I lack myself. How to be a stud! To gain that gravitas of masculinity. The likes of Jordan Peterson only take one so far, and information on scriptural approaches to work-ethic are rare. So, I open the floor to both manly sasquatches and and the cryptozoologists (ladies) who follow them; what manners maketh man?

(Not looking necessarily for debate, but more a list of best things to focus on for masculine development. Thanks!)
Click to expand...
Stop talking so much, not you lol but men in general. Particularly men who hold knowledge on one particular subject like to overshare far too much at the beginning, it's overwhelming and rude.
Women want to enjoy a variety of conversation, not listen to a man harp on the same subject for hours upon hours. A knowledgeable man is attractive but not when he doesn't know how or when to use it. It often times comes across as insecure when he's incapable of other conversation.
 
LovesDogs said:
Stop talking so much, not you lol but men in general. Particularly men who hold knowledge on one particular subject like to overshare far too much at the beginning, it's overwhelming and rude.
Women want to enjoy a variety of conversation, not listen to a man harp on the same subject for hours upon hours. A knowledgeable man is attractive but not when he doesn't know how or when to use it. It often times comes across as insecure when he's incapable of other conversation.
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This is good advice in general when dealing with anybody, but especially women.
People like to talk about themselves. Anybody reading this can try it for themselves. Meet a new person and just ask questions, lead them to talk 90% about themselves and give very few details about your own life. I did this in college as an experiment and asked her friend to informally interview the girl I just had the date with.

She was asked:
-How well we got along
-How much we connected
-How well she felt she knows me
-How good the conversation was
-If she wanted to go on another date
-Then asked simple questions about me

She talked about herself the whole time, found out next to nothing about me, felt a DEEP connection, we got along splendidly, felt she KNEW me very well, we had amazing conversation and wanted to see me again. All because she talked about herself.

This is borne out in people's interactions with their therapist. They almost all report a feeling of deep connection with a therapist despite knowing nothing about the person's private and personal life. It's all because of the deep and pervasive personal information communicated that creates the connection.

So shut up, hold eye contact and ask her about herself. Ask what she thinks about things, how she sees herself, what those things make her feel like, how the events in her life made her feel. Commiserate with the bad parts, mourn with the mournful parts, rejoice with the joyful parts.

While this isn't exactly on the list of "studly" masculine traits. It's severely lacking on the part of most people in general and can turn a moderately low "studly" man into "dreamy and fascinating".

After trying things like that I was described as "intense", and our time together as "intimate and deep".

Women want to be heard, even if half the time they have stupid ideas on how many dogs is reasonable. :p
 
NickF said:
She talked about herself the whole time, found out next to nothing about me, felt a DEEP connection, we got along splendidly, felt she KNEW me very well, we had amazing conversation and wanted to see me again. All because she talked about herself.
Click to expand...
That is eye-opening, never thought of it that way.
 
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DawoodSaar said:
I've been mentoring a young man, aged 19, who just recently came to Christianity in the last few months. I've definitely given him a completely different trajectory than the mainstream already.

I've told him my story of going Hebrew-Roots-ish, how so much of Christian dogma is dogdoodoo, and presented significantly clearer views on about every major point of debate still ongoing in Christendom.
Click to expand...
Back to this point - remember that the important thing is to have him become genuinely passionate about following God, through Jesus. NOT about getting him to believe the "right" dogma. If your Christian mentoring focusses on getting him to see all the things that the establishment church has wrong, you will cause him to feel a loner with little connection to his Christian brothers around him. If he's really, really strong he may thrive like this - but if he wavers he may fall without support.

Fundamentally, Christianity is about becoming a member of a Kingdom - with many, many other people who are also members of that Kingdom. We all disagree on dogma, and we all have things wrong (and don't realise it, because if we realised it we wouldn't be wrong any more), and we change our own understanding through our lives. Dogma is not what matters (even polygamy). Faith in God and communion / fellowship with other believers are far more important.

Don't give him "a completely different trajectory than the mainstream". Point him towards the mainstream church - while also teaching him sound doctrine, but more importantly, skills on how to analyse and determine sound doctrine for himself. If the mainstream church rejects him, that's on them. But don't encourage him to prematurely reject them. He's their brother.

I am involved in different ways with two our two most geographically local churches (one of which kicked me out several years ago over polygamy but who we remain in contact with), and individual local Christians (I'll be helping a local Christian woman with some farm tasks this afternoon, for instance - a woman who completely disagrees with me on almost every point of dogma, to the point that she doesn't even want to discuss dogma for fear it would damage friendship, but she is still my sister in Christ).

Should persecution come, you need locals you can stand with. And you need to have those relationships with local Christians long before the persecution begins.
 
And swinging back to manliness - getting out and being active in your local Christian community looks manly.
Trying to find the perfect dogma and focussing on that, especially if you talk about that too much, turns people away (especially women) and does not look manly.
 
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