Exodus 20:3 (KJV)
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
If you worship Jesus (Yeshua) as a manifestation of God (YHWH), how can you be sure that you haven’t violated YHWH’s command to have no other gods before Him?
Is it more common than not that Messianic/Hebrew Roots/TO folks believe Jesus is the Son of God only?
Yeshua constantly taught people to pray to the Father, to worship the Father. I do believe there is an overemphasis on praying to and worshiping Yeshua instead of the Father whom He was pointing us towards. And the very many Christian songs worshipping the Holy Spirit are highly questionable as we are never taught to worship the Spirit.Exodus 20:3 (KJV)
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
If you worship Jesus (Yeshua) as a manifestation of God (YHWH), how can you be sure that you haven’t violated YHWH’s command to have no other gods before Him?
In the Revelation we are told of the seven spirits of God. Not one Spirit, but seven Spirits. How does that fit into the Trinity?I accept that the concept behind the Trinity doctrine is true, somehow God is triune. We see all three entities at once at Christ's baptism.
But anyone noticed there only seems to be one entity presented in the Revelation? I wonder if the triune state is eternal. It MAY have come about at creation and it MAY come to a close with the end of the age. But I agree with @jacobhaivri that no one really understands this.
The seven spirits are tied somehow to the seven churches. I don't think they have anything to do with God's nature.Yeshua constantly taught people to pray to the Father, to worship the Father. I do believe there is an overemphasis on praying to and worshiping Yeshua instead of the Father whom He was pointing us towards. And the very many Christian songs worshipping the Holy Spirit are highly questionable as we are never taught to worship the Spirit.
Nevertheless, I agree with @Ancient Paths and @Verifyveritas76 that Yeshua is a manifestation of God the Father. I see Him as the mouthpiece through which the Father speaks.
He is both physical and spiritual. He is the interface between the physical and the spiritual. When the Father wishes to speak into the physical world, He does it through His physical manifestation - called the Son in order to allow us to understand their relationship in some way that makes sense to us as biological beings.
In the Revelation we are told of the seven spirits of God. Not one Spirit, but seven Spirits. How does that fit into the Trinity?
I don't think the Trinity exists for a time and then changes. God is the same yesterday, today and forever.
I think the Trinity is a very simplistic illustration that may have some value for teaching children that God has several aspects (the Father, the Son, and the Spirit), but is highly misleading in that it ascribes equality to these three aspects. When as far as I can see the Father is in charge, the Son is his mouthpiece, and the Spirit (or seven Spirits, or the Breath / Wind) is the creative and life-giving power of God who may or may not have an element of separate personhood(s) (scripture is unclear on that). All three are very different, and the reality is that God is beyond our comprehension so we'll never get it right anyway.
A concept can be technically wrong and yet useful simultaneously. For instance, there is no such thing as "centrifugal force" (the supposed force that keeps the water in a bucket when you spin it around your head). However, the idea that there is "centifugal force" is a really simple way to understand why things appear to be pulled away from a spinning object. In reality, there is "centripetal force", which is actually pulling inwards, and it's a bit more complicated to explain. So a child (or adult with no need to truly understand the engineering principles) can simply imagine "centrifugal force" to explain the movement of spinning objects, and an adult needing to do engineering calculations can adopt the more accurate concept of "centripetal force". In the same way, the Trinity can be used as a really simple way to say "God is complicated and has three major aspects" - but should not be considered essential doctrinal truth, someone looking into it in greater detail may adopt a more complex viewpoint.
I don't see seven spirits there. I see one Sprit of God and then six things that are blessings maybe? Fruits of the Spirit? Definitely not seven divisions of God though. I have to admit that I've never even heard of such a thing.The seven spirits in Isaiah 11:2-3?
Rev. 1:4
John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne;
Rev 1:20
The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.
The seven spirits in Isaiah 11:2-3?
Yeshua constantly taught people to pray to the Father, to worship the Father. I do believe there is an overemphasis on praying to and worshiping Yeshua instead of the Father whom He was pointing us towards.
And the very many Christian songs worshipping the Holy Spirit are highly questionable as we are never taught to worship the Spirit.
But anyone noticed there only seems to be one entity presented in the Revelation
Maybe but we are only shown one individual and He never seems to be singled out and quite completely identified. In Revelation 16 when Jesus comes back at the head of His armies He's called King of Kings and Lord of Lords. You certainly don't have the clear separation you see at His baptism for instance.I'm not sure how you get this; the imagery of Christ is all over Revelation.
Lol, I was merely curious if anyone had any information about the % of Messianics that do not believe in Christ's divinity.I think this is kind of complicated. First of all what do you mean by "Son of God"
Mostly, Messianics tote the traditional line of Christendom in this area with just some lingo change "tri-une" was popular for a while; now I think "complex-unity" is gaining but it's all getting at the same thing.Thanks for the replies, y'all. Oh, I definitely remember the Binitarianism thread. It was at the same time I dealing with a very optimistic Jehovah Witness lady.
I had never heard of these Messianics/HR/TO ones before, although there were some hints.. But they came roaring out on some social media threads. Soooo defensive. Maybe some of that "over reacting" and "pent up emotions" from the "oppression" as Ish mentioned. @IshChayil, could it be that one group, say Messianics, over another has more unitarian (not sure that's the correct term) leanings?
Right? And what to do with the "before Abraham was, I am"? Etc......
I mean it's easy for the Jehovah's Witnesses....they just change the words....