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Live by the sword?

Germany was historically the heart of Protestant Europe. The cultural and academic centre of Christendom. It is no longer. I can see why Satan wished to destroy that (through a long series of wars and politics, culminating in WW2). I can't understand why the rest of the supposedly Christian West let themselves become the tool to achieve it. Remembering that Hitler was just a stage in the story and only was in power due to WW1, which in turn only occurred for perverse reasons.

Maybe a lot comes back to the alignment of the USA with secular France (Germany's historic enemy) way back to the war of independence. Then Britain's secretive alignment with France prior to WW1, putting both major Christian powers in opposition to Germany. Satan plays a long game.
 
Germany was historically the heart of Protestant Europe. The cultural and academic centre of Christendom. It is no longer. I can see why Satan wished to destroy that (through a long series of wars and politics, culminating in WW2). I can't understand why the rest of the supposedly Christian West let themselves become the tool to achieve it. Remembering that Hitler was just a stage in the story and only was in power due to WW1, which in turn only occurred for perverse reasons.

Maybe a lot comes back to the alignment of the USA with secular France (Germany's historic enemy) way back to the war of independence. Then Britain's secretive alignment with France prior to WW1, putting both major Christian powers in opposition to Germany. Satan plays a long game.
I'll have to give this more thought. It doesn't sound reasonable on the surface.

Bonhoeffer certainly felt that the Nazi regime was one that didn't represent him as a Christian. Many other Christians felt the same.
 
I'll have to give this more thought. It doesn't sound reasonable on the surface.
That's because I'm talking about a much longer timescale, not just WW2. WW2 was simply the end-game, for Germany. Germany was in many ways the heart of the Protestant reformation and the university centre of Europe, for centuries - that is not in dispute I wouldn't have thought, that's just a fact. Also, Britain and Germany were historical allies, against France - the Anglo-Saxons were from Germany originally so the ties between Britain and Germany run very deep, both through blood and religion. Nevertheless, by the middle of the 20th century, it had been taken over by ungodly leadership, and then destroyed - largely by their own kinsmen the British and Americans. How did Satan achieve this? Through a long series of events, of which I am by no means an expert on, but which I can see the thread of Satan's influence in.

As far as I can see from my limited perspective, Satan encouraged political dealings in Europe through the later 19th century that resulted in Britain, France, America and Russia becoming aligned against Germany and Austria, at a high "elite" level, largely unknown to and against the interests of the common citizens of the countries. For instance, the British military had made secret military alliances with France that even the parliament was unaware of - yet upheld when it came to war. Satan set the stage for WW1.

WW1 was a war between good people (on all sides) led by evil leaders (on all sides). The common people didn't even know why they were fighting, hence the "Christmas truce" on the British / German front in the first year of the war. That was because the regular British and German people held no animosity towards each other and saw each other as historical relatives, allies and friends, they didn't want to be fighting each other in the first place. German POWs would tell their British captors that they couldn't understand why they were fighting against each other, and thought the British should be fighting with them against the French! It was a pointless disaster that should never have happened - but served Satan's bloodlust.

The outcome of that war was an impoverished Germany, treated extremely unjustly at the close of the war, being blamed for the entire conflict, plundered and oppressed by the winners, and forced into severe economic hardship. In desperate times people elect firm leaders who appear willing to solve the problems they face using harsh measures if necessary. The Nazi party were elected solely because of WW1 - they never would have had an opening to get into power if the German people were not desperate enough to resort to them. They were highly successful in lifting Germany out of poverty - but ultimately turned out to be an evil leadership that led to the final destruction of Germany by outside forces. Hence:
Bonhoeffer certainly felt that the Nazi regime was one that didn't represent him as a Christian. Many other Christians felt the same.
The other outcome of WW1 was the Communist revolution in Russia, forming the USSR - an even more evil empire as discussed previously. Again, that also happened because the Russian people were in such desperate need following WW1 that their culture too was sufficiently destroyed so the people were ready for a revolutionary takeover.

This all set the stage for WW2, which in many ways was just a continuation of WW1. By the end of WW2, many Christians had been killed (on all sides). The German historical Christian sites had been bombed to oblivion. Half of Germany was under the control of the communists, who directly worked to stamp out the Church. The other half had religious freedom, but suffered much persecution and economic destruction also.

Satan had taken the core of Protestantism, perverted or killed the people and blown up their history, over about half a century of politics and war. Western Christendom was now left in the leadership of Britain and the USA - but he already had plans to pervert and destroy it there too, just differently, as we've seen subsequently.
 
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That's because I'm talking about a much longer timescale, not just WW2. WW2 was simply the end-game, for Germany. Germany was in many ways the heart of the Protestant reformation and the university centre of Europe, for centuries - that is not in dispute I wouldn't have thought, that's just a fact. Also, Britain and Germany were historical allies, against France - the Anglo-Saxons were from Germany originally so the ties between Britain and Germany run very deep, both through blood and religion. Nevertheless, by the middle of the 20th century, it had been taken over by ungodly leadership, and then destroyed - largely by their own kinsmen the British and Americans. How did Satan achieve this? Through a long series of events, of which I am by no means an expert on, but which I can see the thread of Satan's influence in.

As far as I can see from my limited perspective, Satan encouraged political dealings in Europe through the later 19th century that resulted in Britain, France, America and Russia becoming aligned against Germany and Austria, at a high "elite" level, largely unknown to and against the interests of the common citizens of the countries. For instance, the British military had made secret military alliances with France that even the parliament was unaware of - yet upheld when it came to war. Satan set the stage for WW1.

WW1 was a war between good people (on all sides) led by evil leaders (on all sides). The common people didn't even know why they were fighting, hence the "Christmas truce" on the British / German front in the first year of the war. That was because the regular British and German people held no animosity towards each other and saw each other as historical relatives, allies and friends, they didn't want to be fighting each other in the first place. German POWs would tell their British captors that they couldn't understand why they were fighting against each other, and thought the British should be fighting with them against the French! It was a pointless disaster that should never have happened - but served Satan's bloodlust.

The outcome of that war was an impoverished Germany, treated extremely unjustly at the close of the war, being blamed for the entire conflict, plundered and oppressed by the winners, and forced into severe economic hardship. In desperate times people elect firm leaders who appear willing to solve the problems they face using harsh measures if necessary. The Nazi party were elected solely because of WW1 - they never would have had an opening to get into power if the German people were not desperate enough to resort to them. They were highly successful in lifting Germany out of poverty - but ultimately turned out to be an evil leadership that led to the final destruction of Germany by outside forces. Hence:

The other outcome of WW1 was the Communist revolution in Russia, forming the USSR - an even more evil empire as discussed previously. Again, that also happened because the Russian people were in such desperate need following WW1 that their culture too was sufficiently destroyed so the people were ready for a revolutionary takeover.

This all set the stage for WW2, which in many ways was just a continuation of WW1. By the end of WW2, many Christians had been killed (on all sides). The German historical Christian sites had been bombed to oblivion. Half of Germany was under the control of the communists, who directly worked to stamp out the Church. The other half had religious freedom, but suffered much persecution and economic destruction also.

Satan had taken the core of Protestantism, perverted or killed the people and blown up their history, over about half a century of politics and war. Western Christendom was now left in the leadership of Britain and the USA - but he already had plans to pervert and destroy it there too, just differently, as we've seen subsequently.
I know and understand the history, and essentially agree with it. I was thinking you were making a link to the Nazi regime being the last link in Christian Germany, then being destroyed.
 
Bonhoeffer certainly felt that the Nazi regime was one that didn't represent him as a Christian. Many other Christians felt the same.

Anyone who bothers to read "Mein Kampf" would immediately see that the National Socialists were not at all Christian. There's no need to feel anything about that question when the facts are plain to see.
 
Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. 12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

I'm curious for thoughts on this prospect:
In our current climate, what if we are just kicking against the pricks and seeking to rectify injustices and validating a holy war in the name of righteousness, when we are actually in the throws of judgment? Is it possible that as a nation, we've squandered the experiment and lived too cozily in luxury with zero persecution (no, not shunning or excommunication from churches for beliefs in polygyny)? Is God looking down at us and figuring out how to really toughen us up before the end, rather than seeking to promote more fat and happy?

Feedback?
 
Mojo, my husband has a saying that relates to what you posted:

Soft times make soft men.
Soft men make hard times.
Hard times make hard men.
Hard men make soft times.

I think this is true across time. Empires rise on the backs of hard men and then the empires falter at the hands of soft men who think that what was won by blood and sweat can be preserved by palace intrigues.

It will be interesting to see if we still have fifty united states by the end of next year.
 
It will be interesting to see if we still have fifty united states by the end of next year.
I'm not sure the timetable will be that soon, but I entirely expect the rumbling to continue through next year. I'm reading the same tea leaves as you though. If we can't resolve our national issues soon, we cannot remain whole.

"May you live in interesting times"
 
We won’t be broken up, but both political parties will probably be destroyed.
Or at least decapitated.
 
We won’t be broken up, but both political parties will probably be destroyed.
Or at least decapitated.
I'm interested in what you mean. Can you explain?
 
I don’t think that we will lose any states.
The leadership of both parties seems to be one cozy group bought off by the Chinese. They will be destroyed by the time that this ends. DJT will be Last Man Standing.
Whether new parties are created, or the current parties revived under just leadership, remains to be seen.
SCOTUS will probably lose a couple of compromised members.

Trump is looking very weak, but he is holding all of the high cards as he allows the system to play itself out.
 
I don’t think that we will lose any states.
The leadership of both parties seems to be one cozy group bought off by the Chinese. They will be destroyed by the time that this ends. DJT will be Last Man Standing.
Whether new parties are created, or the current parties revived under just leadership, remains to be seen.
SCOTUS will probably lose a couple of compromised members.

Trump is looking very weak, but he is holding all of the high cards as he allows the system to play itself out.
Thanks.

Not sure I agree with your points, save the Chinese buy off of our leaders.

However, I could easily see Trump revive the Reform party and run as an "Independent" in 2024 as a sort of bloodless revolution should he end up losing his fight for 2020.

It would be a TR campaign all over again as Trump leads a populist movement against the leftists in the Dem party and the pragmatic traditionalists in the Repub party. That might doom the Republicans, but almost certainly elect a Dem
 
If he loses this fight, there is NO 2024.
 
We'll see.
Seriously, how can there be another chance?
If they succeed in this fraud, then fraud becomes institutionalized and they will win everything from here on out. They will own the country forever.

Who are “they”?
Who are the puppet masters?
Who have designed all of this?

It didn’t happen by accident.
 
Seriously, how can there be another chance?
If they succeed in this fraud, then fraud becomes institutionalized and they will win everything from here on out. They will own the country forever.

Who are “they”?
Who are the puppet masters?
Who have designed all of this?

It didn’t happen by accident.

I live in 2020 (soon to be 2021)
I'll be sure to check this thread in November of 2024 if I'm still alive.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but since I don't know the future...We'll see.
 
I live in 2020 (soon to be 2021)
I'll be sure to check this thread in November of 2024 if I'm still alive.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but since I don't know the future...We'll see.
Since he will be at the wheel when it is all over, (and that may not be by the 20th) this is just us flapping our lips.
 
I
Who are “they”?
Think they are part of the army that can "fall on the sword and shall not be wounded."

It doesn't seem to matter what truth (sword) is against them....the game just goes on.
 
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