Apologies for language and, well, everything, but there is no better illustration of that than:
Last edited:
-
Biblical Families is not a dating website. It is a forum to discuss issues relating to marriage and the Bible, and to offer guidance and support, not to find a wife. Click here for more information.
MALE vs FEMALE PROCREATIVE NATURE
- Thread starter JudahYAHites
- Start date
That is funny and true!!!
Trivia: I saw Eddie Murphy a few times when I lived with my mom in Sacramento. Used to see him shopping and he'd wear sunglasses and a hat and dress plain but if he laughed you knew exactly who he was!
Your chart leaves out the impact of pregnancy and children on a woman's commitment to a man.
It certainly doesn't make the distinction. That's an interesting point. I'll have go back and find the paper it came from and see if there is context given there. Wouldn't surprise me if filtering out those factors is how we arrive at this:
But I'm just guessing now.
You're guessing correctly. That chart takes into account everything, because there's no distinction. @Megan, you have to recognize that your experience is not only anecdotal evidence but evidence from many years ago now. The times they are indeed a-changin' -- and rapidly. Also, Megan, you have to remember that you would be represented as well as being part of those high bars on the left-hand side of the graph (low body count).
The higher the body count, the less effect even pregnancy and childbirth have on persuading women to stick around. We always have to remember that the family court systems are designed in a way to provide women incentives to leave.
That chart gets its evidence from the 2004 Teachman analysis of the data found in the 1995 National Survey of Family Growth.
If evidence from many years ago is a disqualifier then the chart, the study, and the data are become irrelevant.
You might note that I referred to evidence from many years ago augmenting only being anecdotal evidence.
In fact, while that study is from 2004, the vast majority of the subsequent, albeit somewhat smaller-scale, data indicates that the disparities are only more marked now than they were then. Common observation of the trends occurring with younger and younger cohorts is widespread. All societal-decline metrics are on the upswing. The next time I run into the chart about how those identifying as gay, lesbian and transgender have created a hockey-stick graph with the rapid increase in those phenomena in the last decade.
I see no way an argument can be effectively made that devolution isn't the order of the day.
Your evidence, like all anecdotal evidence, doesn't change with time -- it will always be what your experience was. What that doesn't address, though, is that, 20 years ago, your anecdotal experience may have entirely lined up with societal norms -- even though now it doesn't line up with as many as 10% of the population. You and I are both societal outliers; what we experience will tell us next to nothing about what is going on in the culture at large -- but we can't entirely insulate ourselves from the effects of what's going on in the culture around us.
Of course, mRNA and the likelihood that it's sterilizing young people will probably make the discussion moot. There just won't be a lot of them having kids at all. Eventually their family lines will come to an end.
I'll get my Unicorn right on that!
I don't disagree with you at all there.
Granted, it would take drastic action to accomplish but I would not rule this out. The most unlikely things seem to keep happening lately.
Like COVID wasn't real and then it was.
Lockdowns would never happen and then they did.
A year ago the prospect of artificial intelligence was ridiculed and mocked and now it's commonplace.
Strange things can happen.
A black swan is a highly improbable event with three principal characteristics: It is unpredictable; it carries a massive impact; and, after the fact, we concoct an explanation that makes it appear less random, and more predictable, than it was. The astonishing success of Google was a black swan; so was 9/11. For Nassim Nicholas Taleb, black swans underlie almost everything about our world, from the rise of religions to events in our own personal lives.
Why do we not acknowledge the phenomenon of black swans until after they occur? Part of the answer, according to Taleb, is that humans are hardwired to learn specifics when they should be focused on generalities. We concentrate on things we already know and time and time again fail to take into consideration what we don’t know. We are, therefore, unable to truly estimate opportunities, too vulnerable to the impulse to simplify, narrate, and categorize, and not open enough to rewarding those who can imagine the “impossible.”
Right here and now I'm declaring for all to hear that, if the elimination of hormonal birth control comes to pass, I will not only acknowledge it as a black swan event but proclaim you to have been a prophet.
And, yes, miracles do occur, but my prophecy is that, if the black swan event of women giving up hormonal birth control transpires, it will be preceded by a prior black swan event of the majority of men in this world reclaiming their headship and removing all rewards for women who use such birth control or who operate under any other form of Independence Delusion.
But, amen, if women were to give up birth control, on their own without male influence or coercion, that would indeed be a miracle.
I am not a prophet but an observer.
Unlikely things happen and the people who reflexively mock and ridicule thoughts outside the mainstream groupthink du jour are often disastrously wrong. I strive not to be one of them.
This to me was one of the best examples of groupthink getting smacked right in its smirky, smug, arrogant face:
Every last laughing hyena on the panel and in the audience was DEAD WRONG.
One of the most in-your-face, spot-on clips of all time -- I never fail to enjoy it.
But you're not just observing in the case of what we're talking about; you're just making a wishful-thinking prediction. Coulter presented the evidence for why Trump winning was not unlikely. It's not enough to just say, "Well, unlikely things have happened! So you can't rule out the possibility that X will happen." That's a conversation stopper, because the only polite, respectful option for the audience of such a statement is to acknowledge, that, yes, nothing is impossible -- a true statement, but just not particularly useful when navigating the Real World. Decisions have to be made, and what we use to guide decision making are known facts and predictions based on known facts.
What, my very dear friend, is your observed evidence that birth control might possibly be taken out of the equation?
You asserted, quite rightly, that strange things can and do happen, but then you provided a flawed list of supposedly strange and unexpected things:
- "COVID": I'm at a loss to discern any way in which "COVID" ever tangibly changed from being unreal to real. People gaslit us in opposing directions, no doubt, but that has nothing to do with whether it's real or not. People gaslighting us and even being inconsistent in their gaslighting occurs on a regular basis, so I see nothing unexpected about "COVID;" that some people were surprised or shocked by things they 'learned' about it is also the opposite of what one would expect.
- Lockdowns: again, all that changed were opinions. Lockdowns have occurred all throughout the history of humanity and have even happened previously in the United States. Swamp gas emerging from human oral orifices most certainly opined that lockdowns wouldn't occurred, but that a lockdown could occur was never tangibly in question. Fauci accomplished a smaller degree of lockdowns with his AIDS Hoax back in the 80s and 90s, so it wasn't even novel in our lifetimes.
- I don't know who was ridiculing AI a year ago, but that would have just been a matter of being ill-informed, not that AI went from impossible to a fait accompli.
The anti-pill narrative is gaining MASSIVE traction.
You'll find no argument from me as far as it being a near-total destructive force, and I'm well aware that opposition is growing.
I don't see this as evidence that the majority of females will give it up, however. Many will, but most are disincentivized from doing so, because eschewing hormonal birth control (much less birth control in general, as a large proportion of those giving up hormonal birth control are moving to copper and other IUDs) removes their ability to sexually party without pregnancy concerns, followed by their ability to have sole control over the number of children they saddle themselves with (from their perspective, not mine).
I really think if any of you had the years of experience I had running university dormitories between 1982 and 1999 (not to mention my staying in touch with the field since then to see that things have only further deteriorated), you would have no doubt that, no matter what kind of spiritual awakenings you observe in your own small circles, the majority youth culture is absolutely dominated by the behavior of young women on birth control. College environments are like rocket fuel for this, because the universities, in order to maximize the number of students who attend, basically carry out a policy of providing students with more privileges and freedoms that full adults have, combined with less responsibilities (other than some part-time schoolwork) or restrictions than elementary-school-age children have. Orgies are commonplace, and it doesn't matter to the females that they're now 2/3 to 3/4 of the student population; only a small minority of females avoid promiscuity, and this was true as far back as the late 1990s; the girls don't at all seem to mind that they're recycling the same small subset of guys.
So I remain convinced that, if the miracle of women predominantly giving up birth control occurs, it will necessarily be preceded by the much-more-plausible miracle of men regrowing their spines and re-establishing their collective headship in our culture. Women will not create the solutions to their own problems. The closest thing they've ever done to do so can be encapsulated by pointing to the book Our Bodies, Our Selves -- and that itself is part of the feminism rocket fuel for the cavalier attitude females have developed toward their sexuality, their reproductive choices, and their collective ability to pair-bond.
What in my post constituted a prediction?
None. Just that things happen and to assume that birth control will be eternally accepted is just as unfounded as saying it won't be.
You, my dear friend, are one of the people I am talking about who can't mentally prepare for unexpected events to occur.
I propose that unexpected events can occur and sometimes we should be giving the world a nudge in the direction we want it to go instead of just passively kvetching about how things are so bad.
Birth control is very much at the root of many societal ills. The advent of birth control was pushed by evil people such as lesbian feminists and Marxists who saw it as a tool for destroying Western society. They used it to attack and destroy the family and they've been endlessly successful.
I'm simply saying that a lot of the things we are challenged by on this forum are themselves rooted in the use of and the culture downstream of birth control use.
You do not see this as a likely possibility but I see it as more likely today than it was four years ago.
Why?
Parents are waking up to the sickness that sexual degenerates are spreading in the public schools and they're standing up to it. Not even the goons from the FBI are scaring these parents anymore. They're not being silenced and they're not just unafraid they are organizing. That's a significant challenge to the ruling classes in the West and they have been unable to silence it. In fact, their efforts to silence this organic movement drew attention and support to it.
Weimar Germany is a useful parable here. The current West very much resembles the degeneracy of Weimar Germany from the absurd levels of inflation to the abhorrent levels of drug use, corruption, and sexual perversion. Weimar Germany in 1929 bore a stark resemblance to the USA of 2023.
And in Weimar they had an unexpected event in reaction to the degeneracy wrought by the lesbian feminists and their Marxist fellow travelers:
Oh, and I am not saying I expect something as bad as the Nazi regime to rise up in the West.
Nope, I expect something much worse.
And I estimate that when the backlash comes there will either be a collapse of civilization or a drastic reorganization of it with an implementation of much more traditional values and practices.
I do not anticipate Jewish people being herded into death camps. But I can anticipate the probability that people who like to use their own pronouns are going to be among the first to be purged. The loudest voices being always the first to perish in any revolution.
In reading The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire (third volume, Ch. 27) you can see how despite so many indications of acute instability in the Empire that the concurrence of Roman leadership and educated people was that Rome would be eternal. Even as late as 392 when Christianity was taking solid hold of society there were still those who could not conceive of a world absent the Roman Empire.
And then one fine day in 395 the degeneracy that had brought about the weakening of pagan Roman society metastasized among the Legions and the Legions collectively abandoned their arms, they abandoned their posts, and they dissolved. It was not a mutiny because there was no one bothering to issue orders to these men. They simply ceased their individual efforts to enforce Roman hegemony and the Roman Empire effectively ended over that brief period in 395.
No one saw it coming.
Now of course there's all sorts of hindsight analysis that says this or that about why Rome fell and the hubris and arrogance of it all is the inherent assumption that we won't make the same mistakes they did all while we're busy making the exact same mistakes they did.
What's important is that after pagan Roman society was finally extinguished in 420 that the Christian society arising in its stead viciously and ruthlessly hunted down and exterminated the protected classes of pagan Roman society who had been so instrumental in the oppression and martyrdom of tens of thousands of Christians.
The eunuchs were exterminated, the effeminate homosexuals were exterminated, the artists were exterminated, the musicians were exterminated. The pagan temples were either made into churches or destroyed and their blocks and bricks used to build other things.
In three short years Rome went from its apogee in terms of reach and power to effectively ending as a political entity. In another generation the degenerates who were the embodiment of Roman power and corruption were exterminated.
I read these things and to me this is not dry history. Nor is the Bible dry history to me.
These are the chronicles of actual human events that were experienced first hand by the people who lived them and witnessed them.
Can our societies fall? Yes they can. And they can do so suddenly.
Abortion was considered settled law by the baby-killing vermin on the left and then it suddenly wasn't settled anymore. Praise Jesus!
Likewise, birth control can be undone too. Hopefully it will happen peacefully but more likely is there will be a river of blood before that happens. Hopefully a lot of things can happen peacefully but history tells us that meaningful events are rarely accomplished in peace.
In any case, my body of evidence that things like birth control can suddenly be taken out of the equation comes from a good decade of reading, comprehending what I read, and applying what I have learned.
Last edited:
This.... ALLLLLL This. I see things playing out a bit more bleak but... It's what I've been telling my friends and family for the past decade, and preparing for this flavor of a thing to play out. I don't think it's a 100% certainty.. But I'm betting everything I have on the eventuality that something akin to it will be seen in my lifetime. I just pray I have 5-7 years left to prepare.