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Should a woman be a pastor?

Jim an Apostle said:
The same principal
of the idea of not letting the wife be under another man's authority in the church would seem to
a​

pply to the work place as well. There seems to be issues with the concept of a woman being under righteous authority in the church... but seemingly not an issue to be under unrighteous authority in a work place. These comments were only an attempt to show that it seems we cannot take the marriage authority to ridiculous extremes. There are issues that must be assigned to the authority of the husband. But there are other issues that as citizens of the world we all 'submit' to such as rules of conduct in public places, dress codes, even which direction we drive in a bank or drug store service lane, let alone governmental statues. The key word here is submit. We as righteous citizens of this world must decide to which things, the powers that be propose, we choose to submit. Let us never forget that even in a marriage the key word is submit. It is not interchangeable with 'forced.' That is the difference between Kingship and Dictatorship. In a kingdom, even our wives maintain their free-will and ultimately have the choice between submission to a righteous authority or not. Maintaining that righteous environment is what maintains the submission in most instances.
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So as an apostle I'm assuming that you would be providing a godly authority for these other men's wives to function under in the church?
 
My Aunt is a lay minister in Illinois. She spent the better part of 25 years in South Africa doing mission work. Her and Uncle Charles are both Lay ministers. I on the other hand have become an Ordained minister for the sole purpose of performing Wedding Ceremonies. I doubt I will ever stand behind a pulpit to preach the word of God. I have however been a speaker and shared my testimony at a few Church Conventions and gatherings. I am perfectly comfortable with females being Ministers as long as they are relaying God's word in line with Gospels.
 
Sunnigrace said:
I am perfectly comfortable with females being Ministers as long as they are relaying God's word in line with Gospels.
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And there’s the rub, women can’t teach in the assembly and remain in line with God’s word. Scripture specifically forbids women from teaching or having authority in the ecclesia. Women are told to be silent in the assembly. No woman can meet the biblical qualifications for being someone who teaches and oversees the body of Christ.
 
Asforme&myhouse said:
And there’s the rub, women can’t teach in the assembly and remain in line with God’s word. Scripture specifically forbids women from teaching or having authority in the ecclesia. Women are told to be silent in the assembly. No woman can meet the biblical qualifications for being someone who teaches and oversees the body of Christ.
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All true, but that stricture isn't limited to Sunday church gatherings; its a general prohibition from teaching doctrine in any time/place...

A woman must quietly receive instruction with entire submissiveness. But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. For it was Adam who was first created, and then Eve. And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression.
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There is no way around this. It doesn't matter if she's working under the authority of some man or if her husband givers her permission, or if its just teaching other women, or how we would like it to be or what good you might think a woman could do. It is forbidden.
 
rockfox said:
All true, but that stricture isn't limited to Sunday church gatherings; its a general prohibition from teaching doctrine in any time/place...



There is no way around this. It doesn't matter if she's working under the authority of some man or if her husband givers her permission, or if its just teaching other women, or how we would like it to be or what good you might think a woman could do. It is forbidden.
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Agreed
 
There is teaching doctrine, and then there is Teaching Doctrine.
Good grief, a woman simply sharing her testimony with an unbeliever is teaching doctrine.
Let’s not turn them into mutes.
 
steve said:
There is teaching doctrine, and then there is Teaching Doctrine.
Good grief, a woman simply sharing her testimony with an unbeliever is teaching doctrine.
Let’s not turn them into mutes.
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I mean the first one, no wait, the second one, wait...

I’m not saying a woman can’t proclaim the gospel to unbelievers but that is far different than holding a position or teaching in the body of Christ.
 
steve said:
There is teaching doctrine, and then there is Teaching Doctrine.
Good grief, a woman simply sharing her testimony with an unbeliever is teaching doctrine.
Let’s not turn them into mutes.
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One can share the good news of Jesus without becoming a teacher. The message is really simple and only takes a few minutes. And for most people evangelism is just about inviting them to church anyway. But that's not what this is about; this is about women becoming pastors and teachers. Teaching one another doctrine. Leading Bible studies. Running churches. Etc.

I've lost track how many times a man has reported that his wife refuses to follow him spiritually but is instead listening to female book authors, bloggers, or listening to doctrinally bad advice from women she knows.

Women were actually told to teach/admonish one another; but it was to admonish them to love their families and be in subjection to their husbands. If they do that, there is no need for women teachers as that is the husbands responsibility.
 
@steve @Asforme&myhouse @rockfox you guys are almost all correct. It seems you are talking semantics. I’m finding I lean more towards @Asforme&myhouse than anyone...

It’s kind of nice to watch a disagreement being hashed out on here and not be right in the middle of it. Lol ....... although I guess I just jumped into the middle didn’t I? Oh well here we go. :)
 
Asforme&myhouse said:
I’m not saying a woman can’t proclaim the gospel to unbelievers but that is far different than holding a position or teaching in the body of Christ.
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A woman cannot teach, but yet you agree that a woman can teach under some circumstances.
So where is the line?
What are the actual rules?
 
Asforme&myhouse said:
I’m not saying a woman can’t proclaim the gospel to unbelievers but that is far different than holding a position or teaching in the body of Christ.
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Very true.

steve said:
A woman cannot teach, but yet you agree that a woman can teach under some circumstances.
So where is the line?
What are the actual rules?
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It reminds me of Easter morning. The women weren't given authority over the disciples or taught them doctrine. What they did was proclaim the resurrection of Christ. There is a difference between sharing the Gospel with others and teaching doctrine to others.
 
Verifyveritas76 said:
There are some things that women can teach other women that men can only try to.
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I have long maintained that women teaching about poly will produce fruit that males cannot duplicate.
Especially teaching males.
 
Phillip said:
Fear is more of a motivating factor to compliance.
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I'm sorry but we are commanded to fear God and women are commanded to fear their husbands. The word used is phobos and yes it does mean literal fear and so much more. It is impossible to divorce fear and submission in the Bible. Remember that our jealous God commands us to live a surprisingly strict life OR be cast into outer darkness where there is wailing and gnashing of teeth. There is no need to derail this thread with a conversation we have had MANY times in the past. But even a cursory loom.at the Bible shows that a strong dose of fear is a requirement of our faith and there are a myriad of "new testament" passages that explicitly say so.
 
ZecAustin said:
I'm sorry but we are commanded to fear God and women are commanded to fear their husbands. The word used is phobos and yes it does mean literal fear and so much more. It is impossible to divorce fear and submission in the Bible. Remember that our jealous God commands us to live a surprisingly strict life OR be cast into outer darkness where there is wailing and gnashing of teeth. There is no need to derail this thread with a conversation we have had MANY times in the past. But even a cursory look at the Bible shows that a strong dose of fear is a requirement of our faith and there are a myriad of "new testament" passages that explicitly say so.
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Verifyveritas76 said:
I’m just gonna go on record that my wife in particular has benefited greatly from some of the women here teaching her. Sometimes it was one on one and sometimes in a women’s group or assembly. There are some things that women can teach other women that men can only try to.
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One on one (or several women hanging out together) teaching or talking about what it means to be a godly wife is one thing and could be beneficial and not violate scripture. I agree that older women are to teach younger women to love their husbands and care for their families. The issue i have is that Paul gives a reason when saying why women should be silent in the assembly. He said Eve was decieve. Why would we as husbands want our wives being taught by someone who is instructed to not teach because she may be easily deceived.

One of the passages in question says women are to be silent in the assembly which leads me to believe that when he says women are to be keepers at home and older women are to teach the younger women he may be referring to teaching other younger wives within the home, as in her own sister wives. That’s my take away.
 
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Asforme&myhouse said:
One on one (or several women hanging out together) teaching or talking about what it means to be a godly wife is one thing and could be beneficial and violate scripture. I agree that older women are to teach younger women to love their husbands and care for their families. The issue i have is that Paul gives a reason when saying why women should be silent in the assembly. He said Eve was decieve. Why would we as husbands want our wives being taught by someone who is instructed to not teach because she may be easily deceived.

One of the passages in question says women are to be silent in the assembly which leads me to believe that when he says women are to be keepers at home and older women are to teach the younger women he may be referring to teaching other younger wives within the home, as in her own sister wives. That’s my take away.
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I like your take away and have thought the same thing myself.

From what I’ve seen and gathered both Scripturally and culturally, the assembly was the primary place where women were to be silent. The Temple had a women’s court for more than just their monthly Mikva. And apparently in Acts, women had a custom to gather at the river to pray. It’d be nice to have more info on that.
 
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