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Useful Scripture References

How Moses married his Ethiopian wife is covered by Josephus in the Antiquities of the Jews, book 2, chapter 10. This is during the first 40 years of Moses' life, while he was still in the court of Pharoah. Basically, Moses ended up being the general of the Egyptian army in a war against Ethiopia. Moses took the King of Ethiopia's daughter as a wife at the end of the war.

In the next chapter Josephus records how Moses fled to Midian and took an entirely separate wife there as per the Biblical account. These are two completely separate women.

Note also that Midian was located to the east of the Gulf of Aqaba - in what is now Saudi Arabia. While Ethiopia was in the direction that Ethiopia is today, but not as far away as @NickF's map as what is now Sudan was historically Ethiopia. But still, they are on opposite sides of the Red Sea and in completely different directions from Egypt. There is absolutely zero chance that anybody in scripture would have had the slightest confusion between the two countries, they are completely different parts of the world. These cannot be the same woman.

Josephus' account of both marriages and their circumstances (Antiquities of the Jews, book 2, chapter 10-11):
Chapter 10.

How Moses made war with the Ethiopians.

1. [About An. 1582] Moses therefore, when he was born, and brought up in the foregoing manner, and came to the age of maturity, made his virtue manifest to the Egyptians; and shewed that he was born for the bringing them down and raising the Israelites. And the occasion he laid hold om was this; the Ethiopians, who are next neighbours to the Egyptians, made an inrode into their countrey, which they seized upon, and carried off the effects of the Egyptians: who, in their rage, fought against them, and revenged the affronts they had received from them: but being overcome in battel, some of them were slain, and the rest ran away in a shameful manner, and by that means saved themselves. Whereupon the Ethiopians followed after them in the pursuit, and thinking that it would be a mark of cowardice if they did not subdue all Egypt, they went on to subdue the rest with greater vehemence: and when they had tasted the sweets of the countrey, they never left off the prosecution of the war. And as the nearest parts had not courage enough at first to fight with them, they proceeded as far as Memphis, and the sea it self: while not one of the cities were able to oppose them. The Egyptians, under this sad oppression, betook themselves to their oracles and prophecies; and when God had given them this counsel, to make use of Moses the Hebrew, and take his assistance: the King commanded his daughter to produce him, that he might be the General of their army. Upon which, when she had made him swear he would do him no harm, she delivered him to the King, and supposed his assistance would be of great advantage to them. She withal reproached the Priest, who when they had before admonished the Egyptians to kill him, were not ashamed now to own their want of his help.

2. So Moses, at the persuasion both of Thermuthis and the King himself, cheerfully undertook the business. (27) And the sacred Scribes of both nations were glad. Those of the Egyptians, that they should at once overcome their enemies by his valour and that by the same piece of management Moses would be slain. But those of the Hebrews, that they should escape from the Egyptians, because Moses was to be their General. But Moses prevented the enemies, and took and led his army before those enemies were apprized of his attacking them. For he did not march by the river, but by land; where he gave a wonderful demonstration of his sagacity. For when the ground was difficult to be passed over, because of the multitude of serpents, which it produces in vast numbers; and indeed is singular in some of those productions, which other countries do not breed; and yet such as are worse than others in power and mischief, and an unusual fierceness of sight: some of which ascend out of the ground unseen, and also fly in the air, and so come upon men at unawares, and do them a mischief; Moses invented a wonderful stratagem to preserve the army safe, and without hurt. For he made baskets, like unto arks of sedge, and filled them with Ibes, (28) and carried them along with them: which animal is the greatest enemy to serpents imaginable; for they fly from them, when they come near them, and as they fly they are caught and devoured by them; as if it were done by the harts. But the Ibes are tame creatures, and only enemies to the serpentine kind. But about these Ibes I say no more at present, since the Greeks are not themselves unacquainted with this sort of bird. As soon therefore as Moses was come to the land which was the breeder of these serpents, he let loose the Ibes; and by their means repelled the serpentine kind, and used them for his assistants before the army came upon that ground. When he had therefore proceeded thus on his journey, he came upon the Ethiopians, before they expected him; and joining battel with them, he beat them, and deprived them of the hopes they had of success against the Egyptians: and went on in overthrowing their cities, and indeed made a great slaughter of these Ethiopians. Now when the Egyptian army had once tasted of this prosperous success, by the means of Moses, they did not slacken their diligence; insomuch that the Ethiopians were in danger of being reduced to slavery, and all sorts of destruction. And at length they retired to Saba, which was a royal city of Ethiopia, which Cambyses afterwards named Meroe, after the name of his own sister. The place was to be besieged with very great difficulty, since it was both incompassed by the Nile quite round; and the other rivers Astapus and Astaboras made it a very difficult thing for such as attempted to pass over them. For the city was situate in a retired place, and was inhabited after the manner of an island; being incompassed with a strong wall, and having the rivers to guard them from their enemies; and having great ramparts between the wall and the rivers; insomuch, that when the waters come with the greatest violence it can never be drowned: which ramparts make it next to impossible for, even such as are gotten over the rivers, to take the city. However, while Moses was uneasy at the army’s lying idle, (for the enemies durst not come to a battel,) this accident happened; Tharbis was the daughter of the King of the Ethiopians: she happened to see Moses, as he led the army near to the walls, and fought with great courage: and admiring the subtilty of his undertakings, and believing him to be the author of the Egyptian success, when they had before despaired of recovering their liberty; and to be the occasion of the great danger the Ethiopians were in, when they had before boasted of their great atchievements, she fell deeply in love with him: and upon the prevalency of that passion, sent to him the most faithful of all her servants to discourse with him upon their marriage. He thereupon accepted the offer, on condition she would procure the delivering up of the city; and gave her the assurance of an oath to take her to his wife: and that when he had once taken possession of the city he would not break his oath to her. No sooner was the agreement made, but it took effect immediately: and when Moses had cut off the Ethiopians, he gave thanks to God, and consummated his marriage, and led the Egyptians back to their own land.

Chapter 11.

How Moses fled out of Egypt, unto Midian.

1. [About An. 1582] Now the Egyptians, after they had been preserved by Moses, entertained an hatred to him; and were very eager in compassing their designs against him: as suspecting that he would take occasion, from his good success, to raise a sedition, and bring innovations into Egypt; and told the King, he ought to be slain. The King had also some intentions of himself to the same purpose: and this as well out of envy at his glorious expedition at the head of his army, as out of fear of being brought low by him: and, being instigated by the sacred Scribes, he was ready to undertake to kill Moses. But when he had learned beforehand what plots there were against him, he went away privately; and because the publick roads were watched, he took his flight through the deserts, and where his enemies could not suspect he would travel: and though he was destitute of food, he went on, and despised that difficulty couragiously. And when he came to the city of Midian, which lay upon the Red Sea, and was so denominated from one of Abraham’s sons by Keturah; he sat upon a certain well, and rested himself there after his laborious journey, and the affliction he had been in. It was not far from the city: and the time of the day was noon. Where he had an occasion offered him, by the custom of the countrey, of doing what recommended his virtue, and afforded him an opportunity of bettering his circumstances.

2. For that country having but little water, the shepherds used to seize on the wells before others came; lest their flocks should want water; and lest it should be spent by others before they came. There were now come therefore to this well, seven sisters, that were virgins, the daughters of Raguel a Priest; and one thought worthy by the people of the country of great honour: these virgins, who took care of their father’s flocks; which sort of work it was customary, and very familiar for women to do in the countrey of the Troglodytes: they came first of all, and drew water out of the well in a quantity sufficient for their flocks, into troughs; which were made for the reception of that water. But when the shepherds came upon the maidens, and drove them away, that they might have the command of the waters themselves, Moses, thinking it would be a terrible reproach upon him if he overlooked the young women under unjust oppression; and should suffer the violence of the men to prevail over the right of the maidens, he drove away the men, who had a mind to more than their share; and afforded a proper assistance to the women: who when they had received such a benefit from him, came to their father, and told him, how they had been affronted by the shepherds, and assisted by a stranger; and intreated that he would not let this generous action be done in vain, nor go without a reward. Now the father took it well from his daughters that they were so desirous to reward their benefactor; and bid them bring Moses into his presence, that he might be rewarded as he deserved. And when Moses came, he told him what testimony his daughters bare to him, that he had assisted them; and that, as he admired him for his virtue, he said, that Moses had bestowed such his assistance on persons not insensible of benefits, but where they were both able and willing to return the kindness, and even to exceed the measure of his generosity; so he made him his son, and gave him one of his daughters in marriage; and appointed him to be the guardian and superintendent over his cattel: for of old all the wealth of the barbarians was in those cattel.
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Josephus obviously isn't scripture, he is a historian and is not inerrant. Nevertheless, he is highly regarded, and what he says on this does not contradict scripture but aligns with it fully. We know from scripture that Moses had an Ethiopian wife, and a Midianite wife, and how he gained the Midianite. Josephus fills in the blank and tells us how he gained the Ethiopian. Now, maybe he's wrong in a detail or two. But he's a whole lot more likely to be correct in the general overall gist of the account than any alternative hypothetical story that any of us could invent. Sound scholarship is to accept Josephus as broadly correct unless evidence arises to contradict it - and there is no scriptural evidence to contradict it.

Note that scripture explicitly tells us that Moses was "mighty in words and deeds" before the age of 40 (Acts 7:22). What were these "mighty deeds" he did before the age of 40? Scripture doesn't say, only Josephus does. Unless we're going to make up complete fiction on our own, the best we can do to understand the truth is to read Josephus.
 
FollowingHim said:
Josephus' account of both marriages and their circumstances (Antiquities of the Jews, book 2, chapter 10-11):
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NickF said:
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There's enough sauce here to convince anyone there were two. Unfortunately for the dynamite, however, the Ethiopian was the first wife. That was a plot twist. No matter. There is also plenty of validation for Zipporah, the second wife.

It's actually a nice twist because now we have evidence that puts both women as his wives at the same time. Close the door on "one died and then he married again", because we know where he was when he married Zipporah and when she returned to him from her father, and now we know that the Ethiopian was in his life before and in between those two events.
 
Found a fascinating article showing archaeological and historical evidence for this Egyptian / Ethiopian war. You can ignore the obligatory section where they try and work around Moses' polygamy and tie themselves into somewhat amusing knots, the rest of the article is fascinating.
armstronginstitute.org

Evidence of Moses's 'Conquest of Ethiopia'?

A lesser-known story of the famous biblical personality—and some fascinating evidence behind it
armstronginstitute.org armstronginstitute.org
 
FollowingHim said:
Found a fascinating article showing archaeological and historical evidence for this Egyptian / Ethiopian war. You can ignore the obligatory section where they try and work around Moses' polygamy and tie themselves into somewhat amusing knots, the rest of the article is fascinating.
armstronginstitute.org

Evidence of Moses's 'Conquest of Ethiopia'?

A lesser-known story of the famous biblical personality—and some fascinating evidence behind it
armstronginstitute.org armstronginstitute.org
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Amen; I'm not in a position to take a stand either way, but many black Biblical scholars have suggested that downplaying the military part of Moses's history on the part of The Church reflects racist attitudes about Africa.
 
NickF said:
Thought I'd add some useful scripture references in a post. This came up as a single friend of my wife was asking for 2 references in the OT and 2 from the NT that supported the idea of a man having more than one wife.
  1. 2 Timothy 3:16-17
    1. All scripture, including the following two which give instructions to men who have more than one wife, or take additional wives alongside the previous wife.
  2. Deuteronomy 21:15-17
  3. Exodus 21:10
These three should end all debate and discussion. Here's the If/Then logic:

If: 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

And the instructions BY God TO men, in how to conduct themselves IF they take another wife, and HOW to handle inheritance if they like one wife more than the other one are instructions in how to be righteous....

Then: Taking another wife alongside the first must then logically be within the bounds of righteousness unless they can find a clear prohibition against it. Since there does not exist a single law against it, prohibition of the practice, denouncement from God, or single condemnation...

AND God chooses to model polygynous marriage to us in allegory in the OT, as well as parable in the NT, we can only conclude that obeying him is righteousness, and mirroring His behavior is acceptable and to be praised.

The following are some of the best I've found that don't take much thought to wrap one's mind around. This is important because most people struggle wrapping their minds around the idea. I have a larger list but the rest mostly just flesh out the picture and put flesh on the bones.
  1. 1 Samuel 25:40-43
    1. Some of David’s wives (no rebuke or correction from God)
  2. 2 Samuel 12:1-8
    1. Pay special attention to the fact that God said if David asked for more wives, God would have given him more.
  3. 1 Kings 15:5 & 2 Samuel 5:13
    1. He took many wives and it was right in the sight of God.
  4. 1 Chronicles 2:18 & 46-48
    1. Caleb entered the promised land with multiple wives when moses was excluded for one sin of unbelief.
  5. 2 Chronicles 11&12
    1. Rehoboam had 78 wives and concubines while he kept the Law of God.
  6. 2 Chronicles 24:1-3
    1. Joash had 2 wives that the High Priest got for him and God said it was right in His eyes.
  7. Genesis 30:18
    1. Leah said God gave her a reward for giving her handmaid to be Jacob’s wife.
  8. Song of Solomon 1:4 & 6:8
    1. The wife of Solomon speaks in a plural fashion. God chose to describe His relationship with us like Solomon’s with his many wives. The Shulamite is the 141st wife.
  9. Jeremiah 3 & 31:27,31-32
    1. You divorce wives, two sisters are listed as the wives of God the Father. Ahola and Aholiba
  10. Ezekiel 16&23
    1. God married two sisters, Ahola (Samaria/Israel) and Aholiba (Jerusalem/Judah) God does not tolerate or abide sin, he does not portray himself as sinful even in allegory.
  11. Isaiah 4
    1. Isaiah 3 is destruction, 4 is God dwelling with the people who have been made clean, where 7 women will be the wives of one man. A woman’s reproach is almost always childlessness in scripture. The other excused requirements are a reference to Exodus 21:10. God does not dwell with sin.
  12. Matthew 22:1-10 & 25:1-13
    1. You need to read the Greek because the translators changed plural words (γάμους gamous) to singular forms (γάμος gamos) contrary to what Jesus clearly said.

The below bold words are using the plural word instead of the singular form as it was written in all the Greek manuscripts but mysteriously the translators changed it into a different word that presumably matches the monogamy only teachings of the catholic church.

Mat 22:1
And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said,
Mat 22:2
The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made marriages for his son,
Mat 22:3
And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the weddings: and they would not come.
Mat 22:4
Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriages.
Mat 22:5
But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:
Mat 22:6
And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them.
Mat 22:7
But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.
Mat 22:8
Then saith he to his servants, The wedding (singular marriage feast) is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.
Mat 22:9
Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriages.
Mat 22:10
So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the weddings [were] furnished with guests.
Mat 22:11
And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding (singular) garment:
Mat 22:12
And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding (singular) garment? And he was speechless.
Mat 22:13
Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Mat 22:14
For many are called, but few are chosen.

Many what are called? Many brides. I’m not an outsider, I have a “one spirit” relationship with Jesus like a husband has a “one flesh” relationship with his wife. I’m not a “bridesmaid” who would be excluded from being married to the Lamb. This is paralleled in the following parable where the Bridegroom (Jesus) takes 5 virgin brides to the marriage chamber where the marriages plural were consummated.

Mat 25:1
Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.
Mat 25:2
And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.
Mat 25:3
They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:
Mat 25:4
But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.
Mat 25:5
While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.
Mat 25:6
And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
Mat 25:7
Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.
Mat 25:8
And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
Mat 25:9
But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.
Mat 25:10
And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriages: and the door was shut.
Mat 25:11
Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
Mat 25:12
But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know (the hebrew use of “know” is sexual intimacy) you not.
Mat 25:13
Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.


13. 1 Timothy 4:1-3
  1. Forbidding a woman to marry an already married man, and forbidding a man who is married from marrying an eligible woman is forbidding to marry.
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What Greek manuscript? Or maybe I should say how do I find that manuscript to verify the plural vs singular in Matthew 22 and 25?
I thought maybe Strongs concordance would verify that, but it presents the singular 🤔
 
Happyhen said:
What Greek manuscript? Or maybe I should say how do I find that manuscript to verify the plural vs singular in Matthew 22 and 25?
I thought maybe Strongs concordance would verify that, but it presents the singular 🤔
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I'm trying to post a response but it's not working for some reason @FollowingHim

*edit* apparently I can't copy and paste Greek?
 
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happy hen's answer.png


TR mGNT LXX
  • N-APM (6x)
N-APM
Occurrences:6 times in 6 verses
Speech: Noun
Parsing: Accusative Plural Masculine

Matt 22:2 - The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage G1062 for his son,

Matt 22:3- And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: G1062 and they would not come.

Matt 22:4 - Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage. G1062

Matt 22:9 - Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage. G1062
Matt 25:10- And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: G1062 and the door was shut.

Luke 14:8- When thou art bidden of any man to a wedding, G1062 sit not down in the highest room; lest a more honourable man than thou be bidden of him;
Those are all translated into english as a singular form when they're written in Greek as a plural. Why? It seems like it's for the purpose of hiding the fact that God arranged marriages for His son. Otherwise if they translated all the plural forms of that word, the fact would be plain and clear to any reader. Romans 1:18 comes to mind.... Seems like someone's been suppressing the truth.
 
Happyhen said:
What Greek manuscript? Or maybe I should say how do I find that manuscript to verify the plural vs singular in Matthew 22 and 25?
I thought maybe Strongs concordance would verify that, but it presents the singular 🤔
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There are a number of Apps you can download for your phone that provide access to the different Greek texts, and have full analytical functions. On my phone I personally use Bible Hub, Hebrew/Greek Interlinear Bible, and Koine Interlinear NT. All are very useful but I'm old school, so I use actual Greek Bibles in my office when I study. Hope this helps.
 
frederick said:
There are a number of Apps you can download for your phone that provide access to the different Greek texts, and have full analytical functions. On my phone I personally use Bible Hub, Hebrew/Greek Interlinear Bible, and Koine Interlinear NT. All are very useful but I'm old school, so I use actual Greek Bibles in my office when I study. Hope this helps.
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That’s helpful! Thanks wasn’t sure where to get that info.
Recently shared the idea and proposition with our young adult children. They are convinced their dad has been deceived and is in sin consider a second (my dear widow friend). It is life shattering disturbing to them! Very understandably so.
So lots of page flipping back and forth. They are well versed in the arguments we’ve used in the past. And the scriptures!

So, things are a little tense in our home right now.
We’d appreciate prayers that we each one hear Yahwehs voice as to what “I am supposed to be doing”!
Thanks 😊
 
Happyhen said:
That’s helpful! Thanks wasn’t sure where to get that info.
Recently shared the idea and proposition with our young adult children. They are convinced their dad has been deceived and is in sin consider a second (my dear widow friend). It is life shattering disturbing to them! Very understandably so.
So lots of page flipping back and forth. They are well versed in the arguments we’ve used in the past. And the scriptures!

So, things are a little tense in our home right now.
We’d appreciate prayers that we each one hear Yahwehs voice as to what “I am supposed to be doing”!
Thanks 😊
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I've done an analysis of Matthew 25:10 (attached), from Jesus' parable of the wise and foolish virgins, as an example for you to use in discussions with family, friends, critics, etc. Most people you will talk with have zero understanding (or a totally wrong understanding) of how to know what is actually being communicated in a text. I highly recommend you ask opponents of the idea of biblical marriage to present a sound analysis of passages they are refuting or rejecting with an explanation as to errors you might have made to arrive at your beliefs. If nothing else, it forces people to study the passages out fully and wrestle with the meaning of a given text. Even if they continue to reject the idea of biblical marriage, they then do so willfully in spite of knowing what is actually written. Shalom
 

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Here is that passage in our old Concordant Version of the Scriptures.
20231218_053459.jpg20231218_053522.jpg
Marriages in Greek became wedding festivities in English.

Young's Literal translation says wedding feasts.
 
NickF said:
Those are all translated into english as a singular form when they're written in Greek as a plural. Why? It seems like it's for the purpose of hiding the fact that God arranged marriages for His son. Otherwise if they translated all the plural forms of that word, the fact would be plain and clear to any reader. Romans 1:18 comes to mind.... Seems like someone's been suppressing the truth.
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All bible translations have been translated with a doctrinal bias of some sort even the so called "inerrant" KJV.
In the beginning of the 1611 there is a list of the translators and the demonnations denominations they belong to.
 
Here is the parable of the king who arranged MARRIAGES for his son in our concordant version of the scriptures.20240104_070720.jpg20240104_070734.jpg
 
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