-
Biblical Families is not a dating website. It is a forum to discuss issues relating to marriage and the Bible, and to offer guidance and support, not to find a wife. Click here for more information.
Do we need to be harsh?
- Thread starter steve
- Start date
Does anyone think that those are unacceptable?
Or are you just overreacting again?
I am asking honest questions here. This is, after all, a discussion.
I did use those terms knowingly, thank you for bringing them into this discussion.
Please note, the thread I posted my random comment in is titled, Random Comments. Hence, it is a random comment for the random interest of any random person. Shalom
We all fall short and fail to meet standards ( our own or others).
Is our failure in this a reason to lower the bar?
I think not.
language is part of it but not all of it.
when I was a young man in training I had several employers
one I never wanted to go back to was regularly harsh and profanity was the everyday norm. Some days it was difficult to understand what he wanted or if there was anything to be learned. Many mistakes where made by most of the men under his instruction. Jobs where regularly redone and profit lost.
I finished my time contract with him and was made redundant (best thing they ever did for me) I found another company to work for.
This new company’s owner was the opposite of the first. Not harsh no profanity, calm and clear.
I made a mistake on a job early on. The boss found out and called me aside and quietly explained what the issue was and asked if I could go and rectify the problem.
I was dumbstruck. How he could so calmly and clearly address the issue Without being emotional or harshly using profanity. There was no drama I just got on with rectifying the problem.
I talked with him a day or so later and explained my previous experience with the other company and how I was shocked that he hadn’t been more harsh or severe with me. He explained that he didn’t think it was productive to be harsh and that everyone was better off if we just focused on the issues and finding solutions.
This man was and still is very precise and disciplined , a very clever man.
This business grew to be one of the best , biggest and profitable in town and is still going today
That day I learned and now believe a man can get his point across without need for profanity. A truly clever man will seldom need to be harsh.
I want to be part of a group that asks me to be the best version of myself that I can be.
When I fall short ( and I do often ) I want to be challenged to be better.
that’s challenged as in more like a ministry and less like a fight club.
Is our failure in this a reason to lower the bar?
I think not.
language is part of it but not all of it.
when I was a young man in training I had several employers
one I never wanted to go back to was regularly harsh and profanity was the everyday norm. Some days it was difficult to understand what he wanted or if there was anything to be learned. Many mistakes where made by most of the men under his instruction. Jobs where regularly redone and profit lost.
I finished my time contract with him and was made redundant (best thing they ever did for me) I found another company to work for.
This new company’s owner was the opposite of the first. Not harsh no profanity, calm and clear.
I made a mistake on a job early on. The boss found out and called me aside and quietly explained what the issue was and asked if I could go and rectify the problem.
I was dumbstruck. How he could so calmly and clearly address the issue Without being emotional or harshly using profanity. There was no drama I just got on with rectifying the problem.
I talked with him a day or so later and explained my previous experience with the other company and how I was shocked that he hadn’t been more harsh or severe with me. He explained that he didn’t think it was productive to be harsh and that everyone was better off if we just focused on the issues and finding solutions.
This man was and still is very precise and disciplined , a very clever man.
This business grew to be one of the best , biggest and profitable in town and is still going today
That day I learned and now believe a man can get his point across without need for profanity. A truly clever man will seldom need to be harsh.
I want to be part of a group that asks me to be the best version of myself that I can be.
When I fall short ( and I do often ) I want to be challenged to be better.
that’s challenged as in more like a ministry and less like a fight club.
Just because a thing can be done doesn't mean that it should be done.
I never tire of telling folks that what is deemed legal is NOT necessarily lawful.
The law concerns the commandments of GOD. Legalities concern the commandments of men.
When a legal matter is aligned with the law it is both lawful and legal. Where it fails to align we find contradiction.
I never tire of telling folks that what is deemed legal is NOT necessarily lawful.
The law concerns the commandments of GOD. Legalities concern the commandments of men.
When a legal matter is aligned with the law it is both lawful and legal. Where it fails to align we find contradiction.
Agreed. Just because we can censor and conform to legalities that come from the doctrines and customs of predecessors and current trends, doesn't mean we should.
Also true, as is the inverse. What is lawful isn't necessarily legal. Polygyny, for instance. Or even referring to a male with masculine pronouns in Michigan.
Amen. And the entire foundation of my staunch stance against this obnoxious word snobbery (edit to add: and hypocrisy. I think I will keep harping on that bit. The surest way to uncover deception in your own philosophy is to realize that you don't even follow it yourself.) is that it is a contradiction to the Word of God, and its pathway leads to destruction. I know some see it exactly the opposite, and I ask them to consider where that thinking comes from. I point them to their predecessors, the same ones who bequeathed them the thinking that polygyny was unlawful. They are free from the latter error and bondage, and I would like to help them become free from the former as well. But, as I've been reminded, this is not a street corner and that's not the focus of this ministry.
Last edited:
If you’re looking for the left and right lateral limits then you’re getting warmer…..
true all true Steve
That line is taking the Lords name in vain. All other forms of communication is fair game. A lot of words (labeled cuss words) by women and hanky caring men because … it destroyed their social standing.
I have lived most of my adult life with people that most “Christians” wouldn’t. These people expect and respect truth and forth rightness, if they are acting like an “A” hole they expect to be told, but told in a manner that they will understand and relate to. Example: “excuse me but would you mind not behaving like that toward me?” Yeah, right no Bueno. Or “ hey M/F calm down you’re out of hand quit acting like a F-n a hole!” Message sent, received, and acted upon.
Think about how many people would have never heard about salvation if the Lord hadn’t put me there speaking in their tongue.
Using that understanding the “people” we are discussing here need to be spoken to in a language they understand. If not you are wasting your time and breath. Real men need to step up and ( excuse the use of the term) stand in they gap. With the Armor of God on! Women with their softer side that is mostly agreeable, should leave this to the men. Men need to pull on their big boy pants or the enemy wins.
In his service
Jack P.
Steve I like and respect you and agree with most of what you post. When speaking about our interaction with each other, I couldn’t agree more. However when dealing with the secular world, I believe in starting off with politeness and common courtesy. When dealing with rude people, before I allow disrespect of my savior, my wife(wives) or my self, protective mode kicks in and I will have any kind of conversation they wish to engage in.
Dude this is some of the free speech we like to boast about here in the U.S. and some crowd deciding acceptable phrase.
I m not a moderator on this site. Steve is a big boy and can most definitely take care of home self. With that said you need to roll back what is coming across as a personal attack on Steve. Not cool dude! Because if we are going to devolve into personal attacks, I m sure there are people on this form that could level some personal attacks towards you. I know what little I have read of your posting I could. But because I value being on this site more than referring to your bothersome personality. I will refrain, however if we are at a retreat I would enjoy having this talk with you in person real man to man eye to eye discussion.
Point I tried to make earlier, I wouldn’t be very good orator in a group of purist, you would. In the other hand the Lord has made me in away that I can communicate to classes or types of people that would t hear a word others would say.
That is why my adult children say it is a good thing I’m not in the public work force any longer. I don’t play well with stupid people they make my head hurt.This thread has totally missed it's point. Genesis of this thread isn't because I said something naughty. After "problematic post" I could apologise or don't mention post again. What has actually created this thread is because nobody liked my original post. Why this matters?
Vanguard of BCDC introduction, evil person, gets arrested and you, instead of being happy for justice being served, get totally focused on naughty word. So .... moral system of forum's members it totally out of order if some words are far more important that justice being served. It is is simple, punishment of evil must be near top of values hierarachy. Otherwise, alternative is allowing evil to flourish.
It's total nonsense to spend time to prove what anybody with social IQ of 2 knows. Good person is decent and speaks nicely of other people. It has pleasent speech without vulgarities hard on ear. What is more important and far more interesting is when you should stop being such nice person? It is only worthy point of discussion.
Let's get deeper. Time to start with interesting answer:
So evil is OK, but a$$hole is too much naughty. How......strange.
Calling somebody evil is declaration of social "removal" at all costs. Not having any interaction is best possibility from best perspective of someone called evil. Evil is not tolerated and it sought to be removed. So...firing squad is also acceptable solution for big enough evil person.
Yet, naught word usually describes somebody behaving improperly, but it doesn't have to stop frendship. So naughty word is far less damaging to social relationships. Steve Stifler of "American Pie" fame is precisely someone who has friends and is totaly naughty word.
In any social group there must be way to modify behaviour of other people, otherwise group couldn't function. If violence is out of question and it should be, then only social pressure remains. How strange... See Christians have acceptable wording from great to neutral, but no acceptable wording from neutral to truly evil. So either neutrality or total war by calling someone evil.
Without word like asshole, idiot, deluded, crazy and other harsh words how can you provide negative feedback to someone? Do you truly believe that telling someone "I'm concerned for your soul" has some power as "I like your plan, made by somebody under heavy narcotics influence".
Still think that harsh language isn't useful? Imagine you in person Mr. Fauci. What it would good conversation?
O.....Mr Fauci, so nice to meet you. I'm one of you fans. You are truly legend. I'm so happy half of country hates you.
Yes, it has false interest. Yes, point is to socially disarm Fauci before delivery of verbal smackdown. Yes, point is made him feel hatred.
Why do this?
Well, our social betters were very concerned with some coof, so they made a lot of stiffling measure for us. What can we do? Violence isn't option and regime won't put it's people in jail. So..what now? Long live ridicule, shaming and naughty words.
If they pay their concerns now with social and/or profesional suicide, they will be far less willing to show same concern next time. It is very stressful to feel alone and under threat, without connection with other people. Fate worse than, maybe, jail lifetime.
In Croatia, coof measures promoters have totally destroyed their professional reputations. For next coof, there will be less willing promoters when professional suicide is price.
I think two sources are for this problem. There is push to call any naughty word profanity. Nonsense if you ask me. Profanity is disrespect of sacred. Sacred is "set-apart", special. It's opposite is mundane, meaning regular, normal, everyday life. Sacred is something done against Lord and calling somebody something harsh isn't that.
Second issue is Mr. Nice Guy culture. It is culture of conflict avoidance, lacking any boundaries, passive aggression as method to fight for your interest instead of assertivness. It is culture of avoding offending somebody at any cost. Any harsh words are greatest sin in such culture.
It is great way to make sure everyone feels included and it minimizes conflict. It is great way to treat children and keep family together, but men hate such niceness. So....price is church full of women and henpecked/longhoused pastors.
Why now same-sex couples are made welcome, receive blessing and even gays can become priests? Well, offending such people by explaining their sins is verboten. So...price is churches full of degeneracy.
It is sad that people seem to think that you are a sissy if you don’t use the language of an ignorant and degenerate culture.
We seem to have accepted the idea that crudeness and rudeness are no longer something that is beneath us.
Yet we aspire to a patriarchal culture.
Weird.
We seem to have accepted the idea that crudeness and rudeness are no longer something that is beneath us.
Yet we aspire to a patriarchal culture.
Weird.
I was privileged and blessed, years ago, to have as a mentor a brilliant engineer who was the first in the IBM Boulder Lab to be promoted above then 'Senior Engineer.' We got along well, became great friends, had a number of projects and patents together, etc.
He virtually NEVER 'cussed,' or resorted to 'foul language.' His expertise in his field was undeniable.
And yet, I rememer a project that we had both put our "hearts and souls" into, and which was being destroyed by shortcuts and bad management. We talked privately at length; the technical issues we could handle, but on another level, we agreed there were real problems.
I remember vividly the day we were all in a meeting with upper level project management, talking about why, among other things, the schedule had to slip. Who was to blame, was primarily what the Top Honcho seemed to care about.
Eventually, Nels dropped the "F-word."
You could hear a pin drop.
"I've NEVER heard him say ANYTHING like that!" I heard someone mutter under their breath.
Well, he made the point. I never heard him say anything that crude any other time.
But nobody there forgot his point, either.
To my mind, language is for the purpose of communication. What works in a technical conference might not on a sell drilling site. Or for teaching His torah.
Words carry 'semantic content,' which includes an emotional component. (That's part of the reason I pay so much attention to Scripture in the original language and context. Sometimes the metaphor just doesn't resonate with us the way it might once have, or should.)
Even Eliyahu (Elijah) knew the importance of dropping a crude reference when it made the point to his audience. (See I Kings 18:27! Hint: the KJV loses some of the 'mockery'.
)
That’s the thing, when words are commonly used they don’t have impact. So a new level of shock value has to be created, and the cycle starts again.I was privileged and blessed, years ago, to have as a mentor a brilliant engineer who was the first in the IBM Boulder Lab to be promoted above then 'Senior Engineer.' We got along well, became great friends, had a number of projects and patents together, etc.
He virtually NEVER 'cussed,' or resorted to 'foul language.' His expertise in his field was undeniable.
And yet, I rememer a project that we had both put our "hearts and souls" into, and which was being destroyed by shortcuts and bad management. We talked privately at length; the technical issues we could handle, but on another level, we agreed there were real problems.
I remember vividly the day we were all in a meeting with upper level project management, talking about why, among other things, the schedule had to slip. Who was to blame, was primarily what the Top Honcho seemed to care about.
Eventually, Nels dropped the "F-word."
You could hear a pin drop.
"I've NEVER heard him say ANYTHING like that!" I heard someone mutter under their breath.
Well, he made the point. I never heard him say anything that crude any other time.
But nobody there forgot his point, either.
To my mind, language is for the purpose of communication. What works in a technical conference might not on a sell drilling site. Or for teaching His torah.
Words carry 'semantic content,' which includes an emotional component. (That's part of the reason I pay so much attention to Scripture in the original language and context. Sometimes the metaphor just doesn't resonate with us the way it might once have, or should.)
Even Eliyahu (Elijah) knew the importance of dropping a crude reference when it made the point to his audience. (See I Kings 18:27! Hint: the KJV loses some of the 'mockery'.
Remember when, "Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn," was downright shocking?
(Actually, I heard about it much later...
)