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Concubines... just a bit of mental jousting.

Quickly I wanted to point out the concubine in the book of Judges who is raped and murdered and results in the near extermination of the tribe of Benyamin. It seems her man had no other women. We don't know for sure but he worth considering he traveled around the country only with her
.
OK, I know his is an old thread, but just thought this may be interesting for anyone else researching concubinage.
Some time ago I read a translation of a small book written by the "Yavitz" This is a famous Rabbi, Jacob Emden.
The book is called something like 'pilagesh' (Hebrew for concubine). It's an interesting read but you have to understand it's coming from an Orthodox Jewish perspective centuries ago.
In it, Emden makes the cause for allowing a pilagesh since not allowing it, or P.M. results in potentially disastrous situations like creation of
mamzers (children born out of forbidden unions). He makes the point that a man will often be tempted by his cleaning lady (assuming she's live-in) and if he indulges his fantasy it's often kept secret, then the childrens' father's identity is secret, and you end up with situations where there can be mamzerim coming into the world because the children from the maid couod inadvertantly sleep wtih or marry his children from his wife (incest) .
Anyway many interisting thingsi n that book, I believe I found it as a free PDF online years ago (way out of copyright).

Anyway he claims that a woman may actually prefer to be a pilagesh 1st since, at least in Jewish law (Halakhah) a concubine has the right to leave her man for whatever reason; whereas a full wife must have certain grounds for divorce which are very hard to fulfill in that culture.
I'm not saying this is the biblical model for us to follow, only presenting how a famous Rabbi painted the nuanced difference in status of a concubine versus a full wife. For the man, since she is not given a ketubah, or at least not the same kind of ketubah as a wife, the man does not have to give her financial reparations if he divorces her (gett). So the notion is that concubine may be good to test the waters for both of them and the head wife.

Another thought; for sure concubines are like wives, since when Avshalom violates David's concubines the Hebrew verb used is Na'af, committed adultery. So for sure, a concubine is not like a throw-away or something like that.

Sorry if it's a bit of a ramble, 5:30 am here.
 
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Verifyveritas76 said:
Very interesting. Do you have the exact title available?
Click to expand...
Ok I looked around a bit and haven't found the full title yet. I did, however, find a 20 page excerpt from it.
I'll post this link and look a bit more later for the full pdf again.
http://www.aishdas.org/avodah/faxes/RYE_pilegesh.pdf

Oh a bit more about Emden if you're interested in his works. He was a leader against the false Messiah Sabbatai S'vi; also Emden wrote a book about Yeshua, essentially trying to reclaim him. Of course not acknowledging His status as Son of G-d but ascribing to Yeshua a positive perspective among Jews that He had the result of purging much of the great stain of idolatry from the world. Emden claims this was Yeshua's personal mission in the world which of course is less than what his mission really was but it's a nice early attempt by mainstream Judaism to look positively on Yeshua hanotsri.
 
A few more thoughts... the last chief Rabbi of Israel is vocal publicly of his support for polygamy (unfortunate he was less open about it while he actually was chief rabbi). Recently there was a religious court decision in Jerusalem to allow pilagesh relationships. Specifically the decision was made for a head of a yeshiva (religious school) who's wife is unable to conceive.
 
Thank you for the additional info.
 
IshChayil said:
Ok I looked around a bit and haven't found the full title yet. I did, however, find a 20 page excerpt from it.
I'll post this link and look a bit more later for the full pdf again.
http://www.aishdas.org/avodah/faxes/RYE_pilegesh.pdf

Oh a bit more about Emden if you're interested in his works. He was a leader against the false Messiah Sabbatai S'vi; also Emden wrote a book about Yeshua, essentially trying to reclaim him. Of course not acknowledging His status as Son of G-d but ascribing to Yeshua a positive perspective among Jews that He had the result of purging much of the great stain of idolatry from the world. Emden claims this was Yeshua's personal mission in the world which of course is less than what his mission really was but it's a nice early attempt by mainstream Judaism to look positively on Yeshua hanotsri.
Click to expand...
BTW I'm not endorsing that website. I don't know what else they have on there just was googling for Emden's book and found the excerpt there....
 
By the way; I noticed in this thread there is a lot of discussion about if concubines are really wives or not.
I wanted to make clear for anyone who doesn't know that in Hebrew we don't really have a word for wife.
"wife" always comes into play in English. In Hebrew the text will just say "woman". The idea is she belongs to her man.
In fact, for English "husband" we have 2 words in Hebrew which get translated this way.
1. איש "Iysh" meaning "man" in a similar way to how we use the word woman.
2. בעל "Ba-al" meaning "master". For cultural reasons we translate Ba-al as husband in the context of a man and a woman. In other cases it is a literal master over slaves, an owner of a garden, or an expert at something (master of whatever skill). There is no Biblical Hebrew equivalent for "wife".

For the English word "wife" there is no equivalent in Biblical Hebrew. It's always vague, just meaning woman. The idea is that if you slept with her, she's yours, or at least she better be and no other man can touch her (traditionally not even to shake her hand).
It's interesting that the only word (other than a rare word in psalms) that designates by itself without a context that a woman is in a relationship with a man is פלגש "Pilagesh"-concubine. This word alone indicates she belongs to someone.
But for "wife" there really isn't a word. I wonder if it's because in an ancient polygamous society there is not such a need to designate "wife" since the emphasis is on ownership. In the West, saying "she's his wife" indicates that the woman to whom HE is speaking is forbidden to him in some way since the other lady is his wife.
If the cultural lense is only "is that lady available or not" not "is the man available" since every man is available.
Religious Jewish men don't wear wedding rings usually even though the culture has largely adopted Western monogamy. There never was a need to mark him as "taken".

That being the case we don't need the word wife really. Only when we try to force the bible into a Western, monogamous culture do we really need this word "wife".

Does this make sense guys?
 
Lol, I don't know if anyone has the emotional energy to go back here yet. I agree with you 100% but there is a strong contingent of knowledgeable men who see the need for a covenant as well.
 
Pros and cons....

In western culture, avoiding the word 'wife' helps avoid a bigamy prosecution, so there's that. :eek:

But in western culture, as long as there are hordes of independent single women circulating in public, it seems useful to have some way to designate a woman as 'spoken for'....
 
andrew said:
Pros and cons....

In western culture, avoiding the word 'wife' helps avoid a bigamy prosecution, so there's that. :eek:

But in western culture, as long as there are hordes of independent single women circulating in public, it seems useful to have some way to designate a woman as 'spoken for'....
Click to expand...
Indeed... the Genitive handles this quite nicely...
MINE!!!
 
Word.

I remember seeing a biker rally where the women from one club were wearing vests that across the top of the back said "Property of Mad Dog", or property of whomever. (Mad Dog was really one of the names, though.) In a more aggressively masculine and physical culture, that's probably a pretty sensible approach....
 
Great topic... lots of awesome explanations and Biblical understanding laid out! Had a blast reading this thread! You guys rock! :bible:
 
andrew said:
Word.

I remember seeing a biker rally where the women from one club were wearing vests that across the top of the back said "Property of Mad Dog", or property of whomever. (Mad Dog was really one of the names, though.) In a more aggressively masculine and physical culture, that's probably a pretty sensible approach....
Click to expand...
If it was biblical times, the enemy biker gang could call him "Mad *dead* Dog's *head*"
 
S
IshChayil said:
Ok I looked around a bit and haven't found the full title yet. I did, however, find a 20 page excerpt from it.
I'll post this link and look a bit more later for the full pdf again.
http://www.aishdas.org/avodah/faxes/RYE_pilegesh.pdf

Oh a bit more about Emden if you're interested in his works. He was a leader against the false Messiah Sabbatai S'vi; also Emden wrote a book about Yeshua, essentially trying to reclaim him. Of course not acknowledging His status as Son of G-d but ascribing to Yeshua a positive perspective among Jews that He had the result of purging much of the great stain of idolatry from the world. Emden claims this was Yeshua's personal mission in the world which of course is less than what his mission really was but it's a nice early attempt by mainstream Judaism to look positively on Yeshua hanotsri.
Click to expand...
Sorry guys, I can't find the full book; I only dedicated maybe 15 minutes more searching. If there is enough interest I'll dig deep and find it if it's find-able.
 
I agree a concubine is a wife. Just a different level of connection or in modern terms, "membership".. There are many parts to a body and society tries to lock people into "a or b only" mindset.
I know a friend who always preferred being a concubine, by choice.. No children, no serious stress in her opinion. Now she's in her mid 40's and still chooses that. Free will I guess.. She sort of prefers a Starbucks kind of life over instant coffee and milk. lol
I sat next to a lady once on a trip who said she was happier as the mistress or concubine, it was more fun. Now as a wife, she feels burdened, too much responsibility on her to manage things. The relationship got heavy and stale now.
Many people today choose that, others are by default.. On the bigger picture is ultimately about companionship. Different levels of it..
 
andrew said:
Pros and cons....

In western culture, avoiding the word 'wife' helps avoid a bigamy prosecution, so there's that. :eek:

But in western culture, as long as there are hordes of independent single women circulating in public, it seems useful to have some way to designate a woman as 'spoken for'....
Click to expand...
Taken? Yes, using the word wife in our compliance, obey and pay the beast society, gives beastie legal jurisdiction to get you for bigamy. Because we are too free? Companions is a better term, helpmates etc.. Even best friends works..
Just some sound advice when interacting with the world. Wife is a jurisdiction enabling key word.
Important.. You can ask a more friendly beastie enforcer and you will see is not an exageration.
 
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IshChayil said:
By the way; I noticed in this thread there is a lot of discussion about if concubines are really wives or not.
I wanted to make clear for anyone who doesn't know that in Hebrew we don't really have a word for wife.
"wife" always comes into play in English. In Hebrew the text will just say "woman". The idea is she belongs to her man.
In fact, for English "husband" we have 2 words in Hebrew which get translated this way.
1. איש "Iysh" meaning "man" in a similar way to how we use the word woman.
2. בעל "Ba-al" meaning "master". For cultural reasons we translate Ba-al as husband in the context of a man and a woman. In other cases it is a literal master over slaves, an owner of a garden, or an expert at something (master of whatever skill). There is no Biblical Hebrew equivalent for "wife".

For the English word "wife" there is no equivalent in Biblical Hebrew. It's always vague, just meaning woman. The idea is that if you slept with her, she's yours, or at least she better be and no other man can touch her (traditionally not even to shake her hand).
It's interesting that the only word (other than a rare word in psalms) that designates by itself without a context that a woman is in a relationship with a man is פלגש "Pilagesh"-concubine. This word alone indicates she belongs to someone.
But for "wife" there really isn't a word. I wonder if it's because in an ancient polygamous society there is not such a need to designate "wife" since the emphasis is on ownership. In the West, saying "she's his wife" indicates that the woman to whom HE is speaking is forbidden to him in some way since the other lady is his wife.
If the cultural lense is only "is that lady available or not" not "is the man available" since every man is available.
Religious Jewish men don't wear wedding rings usually even though the culture has largely adopted Western monogamy. There never was a need to mark him as "taken".

That being the case we don't need the word wife really. Only when we try to force the bible into a Western, monogamous culture do we really need this word "wife".

Does this make sense guys?
Click to expand...
The word wife is actually not safe in our "free" western culture. Unles you desire to be a beastie martyr and watch them assimilate you and your family.
As long as you obey and pay, you might feel free? Wise as serpents, harmless as doves..
 
uh oh. :)
 
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